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Post by 8bitretroshit on Mar 9, 2008 4:49:25 GMT -5
But, to sum it up, here's the deal. The only ones who will be added are going to be the ones who are emiersly popular. And I mean Sonic popular. With Megaman not even coming close to Sonic's popularity, he stands a small chance of making, and this doesn't boad well for the others. Nintendo will only add the ones people really really want. As of now, unless something else happens where one gets added, Megaman is the only one who stand any chance, and since he's only wanted by a set group of people (not the fans as a whole) he doesn't stand a good chance. Yeah, Sonic's popular, but don't underestimate Megaman. Both series are highly praised because of the awesome games of the 90's (and both series have shitty games nowadays). Both had cartoon shows thanks to their popularity (both English and Japanese versions) and, really, when talking about the 'triforce' of NES games it's Mario, Zelda and Megaman. Plenty of people actually wanted both Sonic and Megaman to show up, Sonic being Mario's rival back in the day gave him the extra edge to get in. And I believe the big reason Megaman didn't show up this time is because the creator didn't contact Sakurai. Instead he waited for Sakurai to phone him, which didn't work out. Dude's totally willing to put his creation in Smash Bros. So will he appear in the next installment? I damn hope so, in fact I'm expecting it, unless Smash Bros isn't taking the 3rd party road again for some reason. He should be in for the awesome music his games have alone. Alright, as for Nintendo characters it will probably be the obvious characters people were expecting to be playable in this game. I'm talking Bowser Jr., Ray MKsomething (filling the new series slot) and, just maybe, Samurai Goroh. I don't see King K. Rool or Little Mac happening sadly nor any obscure characters, but they very well could appear as the next batch of ATs. That's fine by me. |
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Post by Arcadenik on Mar 9, 2008 8:22:41 GMT -5
I didn't think Smashchu was trying to kill all creativity... I guess he was really trying to tell us to be a bit more realistic and lower our expectations. It may feel like he was trying to kill all creativity but not really. To me, I just love to come up with real creative movesets for popular and obscure characters based on their games and perosnality... even if it may appear to be "out of character" or if they are "not wanted or popular" like Smashchu said.
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Post by Smashchu on Mar 15, 2008 22:29:32 GMT -5
I'm sorry if I killed creativity. That's not my purpose. But, it it is some realism, but also opinion. Some were obvious (like OW). Of course, the Baby Mario idea was good, I just question how it will be recived.
Well, now you guys can drill me
-Issac:After Brawl's release, he seems to be the next most wanted. He was top requested on Smashboards poll for SSB4 (was a topic, but acted like a poll).
-Andy:AW needs representation so a franchise of it's size and caliber would make sence for a character. Also, using my Andy moveset, it would give an original character who fans will like to see and play as
-Retro character:I wasn't sure who to pick. Balloon Fighter is the one I'm really looking at. A character people both remember and want. He'd also have a unique recovery system. Little Mac is another, but there must be a reason he is an assist. Mach Rider was one Sakurai looked at, so maybe.
-King K. Rool. He is a character who is popular in both Japan (he is suposse to be really popular there) and the US. He would also add another heavy weight and be a character people will generally like.
Krystal-Again, a character ho was requested a lot but didn't make the cut. Come SSB4, it will be her turn. Also, the staff will give her some interesting moves (Note:Also, have both adventure and assault costume)
Mii-This was a crazy idea I had a while. Create a Character has become a sort of crazy (might be dead now);user created content is always liked (i.e. Stage Builder). So, this was my idea of how the Smash world could have it. You could take a Mii and give him unique move, replacing his set how you see fit (i.e. Change his fsmash from a Bat to a Tennis Racket, or even a monster punch, or his down air from a kick combo to the straight pose from Wii Play bubble game). You could also collect more Mii parts.
Hidden
Goroh-Again, he is a character that fans will really enjoy. Many feel that with Earthbound having two characters, that F-Zero should fallow suit. He is a character F-Zero fans, and smash fans, really want playable. Anyone else remember his update on the Dojo?
Sami-A unique alternate to Andy but she would play more like an infantry (she could still summon them, but she can only summon infantry). It would add a fun character, and would not be out of place (AW could use 2 characters)
Geno-He is a character with an amazingly dedicated fan base, and is quite popular with the Smash fans. Supposibly, he was the only characters from a Japanese fan poll not to make it. He'd add some nostalgic flare and be quite unique (lots of projectiles).
Ridley is a maybe. It would be how to scale him and how he'd move to make him fit. Megaman is also maybe. Depends on popularity. Right now, he's not popular enough.
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Post by TV Eye on Mar 15, 2008 23:22:54 GMT -5
-King K. Rool. He is a character who is popular in both Japan (he is suposse to be really popular there) and the US. He would also add another heavy weight and be a character people will generally like. It's funny, it seems the Japanese favorite characters, are usually pretty disfigured... |
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Post by Dances in Undergarments on Mar 15, 2008 23:28:59 GMT -5
So Megaman isn't popular enough but Geno on is? Oh FFS.
Also Andy and Sami are pretty much dead now. Replace with Emo Wars equivalents (Will and that chick that looks pretty much like a more realistic Sami I guess).
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Post by mopinks on Mar 16, 2008 0:19:19 GMT -5
So Megaman isn't popular enough but Geno on is? Oh FFS. yeah, seriously. Megaman isn't as popular as Sonic, obviously, but he's still one of the best-known and most recognized characters from one of the best-selling franchises of all time. he's absolutely one of the most likely third-party characters, if another one ever happens. honestly, I really can't think of any character who would be more likely, unless Square-Enix gets in on the action (god forbid). and no, I'm not talking about Geno! |
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Post by Smashchu on Mar 16, 2008 0:46:20 GMT -5
So Megaman isn't popular enough but Geno on is? Oh FFS. Also Andy and Sami are pretty much dead now. Replace with Emo Wars equivalents (Will and that chick that looks pretty much like a more realistic Sami I guess). This is something I've stressed but no one seems to listen. Not even a response. 3rd Part Characters=/=Nintendo CharactersThat's the facts. Yet I always here "Oh Megaman more popular then Nintendo character, thus he in". NO. A 3rd party character needs to be widely popular. As I have said, Sonic got in late. Late. Everyone wanted Sonic and only a select few didn't (mostly spawning from being tired of hearing Sonic). Geno has a strong 1 up on Megaman. While, yes, he has rights like Megaman, so I'll give you that. But Geno is tied to Mario, so in that sence, he gets a leg up. The focus is Nintendo and if you can't see that, please remove the blind fold. Sakurai said he was going to add 3 third parties max. He added 2. The second didn't get in till later into development which is to say it was a close call. Third party characters do not stand that much of a chance. Geno has a strong fan base (this you can not deny) but also is a Nintendo character (Sakurai even put him into that group on the poll). Megaman stands less of a chance due to his 3rd party status, and in terms of want, probably matches Geno at best (he only ranked a 2 on the poll verses Genos 4/5). At the very least Geno has a higher chance just because he is a Nintendo character (at least he is considered one). The point is the standard for third party characters is very high. So high that the odds of one getting in are low. There are a lot of people who want Megaman but they are only a small group. The larger doesn't care. Again, if any third party character is to get in, they need to have Sonic level popularity, and so far, that has not happened yet. Again, 3rd party characters must be widely popular. WIDELY. In that, 90% of Smash fans must want the character. Wanna see something cool Again, you need Sonic popularity if you are going to hang with Nintendo. The original roster he created lacked Sonic (from what we can tell). Again, a lot of characters are popular. But being a third party character puts you off at a disadvantage from day 1. They have to have high popularity, and as we can see, Sonic had that, but still wasn't considered till late. Sorry for the soap box, but how about this. I'm thinking the Mario franchise needs a new character. My chioce right now is Geno. Is there another character who could be better. Toad maybe? Or none at all? Also, I was thinking of adding Roy and Mewtwo/new pokemon. Also, no Geno means Saki could come in (my moveset ideas for both were similar). |
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Post by Dances in Undergarments on Mar 16, 2008 2:29:53 GMT -5
I'm sick of saying this, but Geno is not the next representative in line for a Mario spot. He's miles back in that order, because, quite simply, he's iiiiiiiincredibly obscure. No, not just 'Ice Climbers' level obscure - if Mario is a 10 on some sort of recognisability scale, and Ice Climbers are, say, 1, then Geno is -50.
And stop using the god damn 'poll', that never really was a poll, and never actually proved itself to be accurate (in case you haven't noticed, Geno, Ridley, Krystal AREN'T playable), as a supposed source of whats going to happen in future games.
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Post by mopinks on Mar 16, 2008 3:13:10 GMT -5
Geno has a strong fan base (this you can not deny) but also is a Nintendo character (Sakurai even put him into that group on the poll). Megaman stands less of a chance due to his 3rd party status, and in terms of want, probably matches Geno at best (he only ranked a 2 on the poll verses Genos 4/5). correction: he matches what we saw of the poll, which was just a sampling of the thousands of responses Sakurai received that he chose to comment on. for all we know, he responded to those five Geno requests just because he was surprised by how many requests there were for such an obscure character, and responded to only two Megaman requests because he got a ton of those and didn't think the comments were very interesting. and Megaman's fanbase outranks Geno's by a ridiculously huge margin. there's really no question there. Geno's fanbase is definitely vocal, but compared to Megaman's? no contest at all. Again, if any third party character is to get in, they need to have Sonic level popularity, and so far, that has not happened yet. why do they need to have Sonic-level popularity? no one ever said anything like that. that's like saying all the Nintendo characters in the game need to have Mario-level popularity. if you set the bar that high, they'll never be able to add any new characters to the game. Snake sure doesn't match Sonic's popularity, but he got in for a separate reason. why can't any other character be an exception in that way? Hideo Kojima isn't Sakurai's only friend in the games business. Again, 3rd party characters must be widely popular. WIDELY. In that, 90% of Smash fans must want the character. Snake and Sonic sure as hell don't make the cut, then. Pac-Man isn't as popular as Sonic, obviously, but he's still one of the best-known and most recognized characters from one of the best-selling franchises of all time. he's absolutely one of the most likely third-party characters, if another one ever happens. uh, yes, this paragraph works just as well with Pac-Man. what's your point? it still means the same thing: that a character doesn't need to be as popular as Sonic to have a realistic chance. (but, for the record, Megaman as a character is about a thousand times more popular than Pac-Man as a character. most people remember Pac-Man for the game itself, not the star.) |
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Post by Fryguy64 on Mar 16, 2008 5:16:25 GMT -5
Listen, there appears to be no strict rule for "guest stars". Snake is less popular than Mega Man and Pac-Man combined, but he was the first guest to get in. Sonic is hugely popular, moreso than Mega Man and Pac-Man, and even he was added last minute to appeal to the old Sega/Nintendo conflict camp.
It's clear to me that there are no rules to this game regarding guest stars. They didn't have to start on Nintendo systems, or even be from predominantly Nintendo-system games. In fact, the two characters that have appeared are more famous as Sega and Playstation system characters.
There's no law to follow.
It'd be quite possible for Nintendo to add as many guest stars as they like, from whatever games they choose. Why not chuck in Mega Man, Pac-Man, Bomberman, Phoenix Wright, Bonk...? It's not up to us to write the rules, or follow them.
I would have loved to see Pac-Man and Mega Man in there as well - it would have rounded out the guest stars nicely (2 seems rather low). But they're not. Big boohoo. I still get Pit, Wario, Olimar, PT, and loads more new Nintendo characters.
Next time, I'd like to see more Nintendo characters. You know my shortlist. Anything else is a bonus.
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Post by Manspeed on Mar 16, 2008 7:57:09 GMT -5
I recently realized how much moveset potential Tamagon has. In fact, I also recently realized how easy it is to make movesets work since every character has at least one move that's similar to another character's move. An easy way to decide who to add is to make a new moveset based on a combination of moves similar to a bunch of different characters and find a character that fits them. I'll continue this in the Moveset Factory topic.
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Post by Smashchu on Mar 16, 2008 12:01:02 GMT -5
Listen, there appears to be no strict rule for "guest stars". Snake is less popular than Mega Man and Pac-Man combined, but he was the first guest to get in. Sonic is hugely popular, moreso than Mega Man and Pac-Man, and even he was added last minute to appeal to the old Sega/Nintendo conflict camp. But Snake got presidence over other third parties. He was added since Kojinma and Sakurai were friends. It was a favor. So while Megaman is more popular then Snake (and many characters are) he lacks that edge. He is in the same class as everyone else. Only Snake gets that privilege. True, but where they started is regardless. It's that they have been on a Nintendo system once. But it seems that third party are more scritized (if I can say that right). The low number, as you put it, should make that evident. The point is that they didn't add a load of third party characters. If Megaman was as popular as many people say he i9s, then why is he not in Brawl? I'm sick of saying this, but Geno is not the next representative in line for a Mario spot. He's miles back in that order, because, quite simply, he's iiiiiiiincredibly obscure. No, not just 'Ice Climbers' level obscure - if Mario is a 10 on some sort of recognisability scale, and Ice Climbers are, say, 1, then Geno is -50. And stop using the god damn 'poll', that never really was a poll, and never actually proved itself to be accurate (in case you haven't noticed, Geno, Ridley, Krystal AREN'T playable), as a supposed source of whats going to happen in future games. Seriously, just becuase you say someone is obscured doesn't mean it's true. You have had little to back up anything you have said beyond getting upset. While there isn't much top prove, at least try. As I have said, he is popular in Japan and has a large fallowing. So how is he a bad choice. Give more description. Don't just repeat the same lines and then complain when people don't see your line of thought. Sonic did. Everyone's mother wanted Sonic. Although, my number may have been a bit high (Japan didn't care) but over on this side ofn the world, he probably meet that number. Snake, like I said, get presidence(spelling?). The point was that being popular and from a best selling franchise is like saying I have hair. Lots of people have hair. What's so special about mine? The same is true of what you said. Since I can substitute so many other characters into it, it doesn't hold much water. Like the more dollars there are circulating, the less their value is. |
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Post by Spud on Mar 16, 2008 13:23:32 GMT -5
Listen, there appears to be no strict rule for "guest stars". Snake is less popular than Mega Man and Pac-Man combined, but he was the first guest to get in. Sonic is hugely popular, moreso than Mega Man and Pac-Man, and even he was added last minute to appeal to the old Sega/Nintendo conflict camp. But Snake got presidence over other third parties. He was added since Kojinma and Sakurai were friends. It was a favor. So while Megaman is more popular then Snake (and many characters are) he lacks that edge. He is in the same class as everyone else. Only Snake gets that privilege. Whats stopping Nintendo from using other rational for third party characters later? Seriously, just becuase you say someone is obscured doesn't mean it's true. You have had little to back up anything you have said beyond getting upset. While there isn't much top prove, at least try. As I have said, he is popular in Japan and has a large fallowing. So how is he a bad choice. Give more description. Don't just repeat the same lines and then complain when people don't see your line of thought. Smashchu by people you mean you. The Mario franchise is the most well known game franchise there is and while it would be awesome to see Geno his obscurity dose play a role. As you would put it Mario Franchise =/= Obscure Franchise so when you think about it there probably not going to add playable obscure character from one game over playable Waluigi, Dasy, or Toad. Besides I'm pretty sure we've seen all the characters The Main Mario series is going to get. Sonic did. Everyone's mother wanted Sonic. Although, my number may have been a bit high (Japan didn't care) but over on this side of the world, he probably meet that number. Snake, like I said, get [precedence] I don't know about that Smash. Seems to me there were a lot of people outraged at the Idea, even when Snake was announced there was the camp of Anti-Sonic already taking their stand. |
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Post by parrothead on Mar 16, 2008 14:53:34 GMT -5
It's not just popularity that matters. There are four other things needed for a character to appear as a playable in the SSB series: - Originated from a historical game or franchise (e.g. The first Sonic the Hedgehog for the Genesis/Mega Drive showed what new technology could do for the platform game genre.)
- Originated from a game or franchise that sold very well. Perhaps at least one million copies of it were sold (e.g. Super Mario Bros., Star Fox, The Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past, etc.)
- Has a good set of moves and/or has a unique fighting style unlike other SSB characters (e.g. Each one of Mr. Game & Watch's moves represents a Game & Watch game, while his ringing bell represents the alarm clock function of the LCD handheld series.)
- Sometimes size does matter. If size doesn't matter, then awkwardness occurs. Some people don't care if a character's size is awkward, while some do. If I'm wrong about this, then don't count it.
And here is something I wish will not happen at all:  |
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Post by Manspeed on Mar 16, 2008 18:21:38 GMT -5
That had better not happen. I'd much rather see WB vs. Disney myself. But at the current point in time, Square X Disney is enough. Now, Nintendo X Sega or Nintendo vs. Capcom on the other hand....
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