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Post by Hiker of Games on Nov 19, 2008 19:31:20 GMT -5
Maybe it's just me, but he never seemed particularly bothered about saving the other Kongs in DK64 to me. It seemed like he just happened across them and let them out, they were never stated as his reason for fighting. Only his bananas were mentioned in that context. Surely if it were a selfless act, his friends would've been at the forefront?  One time on the first level of DKC, I had Donkey Kong jump over the DK Barrel containing Diddy in it. Why did I do that? Because I wanted those damn bananas. Less Kongs = More Bananas for DK! |
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Post by TV Eye on Nov 19, 2008 19:33:32 GMT -5
Man-Frog, can't you ever agree with anything? Do you always have to start confrontations?
DK obviously does not have the brain capacity to realize anything besides someone stole his bananas, otherwise he would show even the slightest amount of intelligence, such as speech...perhaps.
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Post by Arcadenik on Nov 19, 2008 20:01:41 GMT -5
DK may be a selfish ape, but he still went out of his way to save the kidnapped Kongs. He could have easily leave them locked up in cages and just look for bananas. DK just can't win, can he? He's damned if he goes out of his way to save the Kongs. He's damned if he doesn't save the Kongs and just look for bananas.  |
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Post by kirbychu on Nov 19, 2008 20:04:17 GMT -5
Each of those cages contained a banana too, remember. |
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Post by Manspeed on Nov 19, 2008 20:05:05 GMT -5
If everybody agreed on everything, the world would pretty fuckin' dull. @ Kirbs: I can understand your point about DK having character, but he's always been referred to and marketed as a hero in everything released in support of the games.At least... not until Rare got cut loose, then they tried to inject some of the DK arcade genes back into him, which renders him more of a side character than a portagonist. Wario and those other characters you mentioned have always been said to be bad guys no matter what If he really was just supposed to be a big greedy ape, then the storyline given for the game as shown in the manuals (and later the cutscenes in the GBA version) wouldn't have him saying "I will hunt down the Kremlings until I get my bananas and my buddy back!" He cares about both equally, not just one over the other. That's what makes him a hero and not an anti-hero. I think you're seeing too much of the arcade mentality in DK these days. |
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Post by kirbychu on Nov 19, 2008 20:15:24 GMT -5
Not really, arcade DK always seemed considerably more evil to me. My interpretation of DK is based on games from DKC onwards, since that was my introduction to the character. But it's also taking into account the Mario sports games, the post-Rare games and Mario VS. Donkey Kong. DKC's manual doesn't even match up with Rare's own later portrayals of the character ("Donkey all confused!"), so I'm not taking it as fact. Besides, it's a manual story, they're rarely wholly accurate, generally being written by different people to the game itself.
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Post by Arcadenik on Nov 19, 2008 20:18:04 GMT -5
Each of those cages contained a banana too, remember. The DK Barrel Diddy Kong was trapped in in DKC had no bananas, remember. If we want to take this far, we could easily say Mario is also selfish because Mario saving penguins, bees, Toads, Piantas, Nokis, and Luigi was only to get the stars so he could get his girlfriend back. |
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Post by TV Eye on Nov 19, 2008 20:42:02 GMT -5
If we want to take this far, we could easily say Mario is also selfish because Mario saving penguins, bees, Toads, Piantas, Nokis, and Luigi was only to get the stars so he could get his girlfriend back. That doesn't make Mario selfish, it makes him a player!  |
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Post by Manspeed on Nov 19, 2008 20:51:11 GMT -5
Not really, arcade DK always seemed considerably more evil to me. My interpretation of DK is based on games from DKC onwards, since that was my introduction to the character. But it's also taking into account the Mario sports games, the post-Rare games and Mario VS. Donkey Kong. DKC's manual doesn't even match up with Rare's own later portrayals of the character ("Donkey all confused!"), so I'm not taking it as fact. Besides, it's a manual story, they're rarely wholly accurate, generally being written by different people to the game itself. The stuff on the manual is also in the game as of DKC GBA, and DK64 seems to be the only time DK acts like he can't speak well. Most of the time he doesn't speak at all. DK acted pretty much the way I expected him too in the sports titles, but for some reason in Mvs.DK he seems a bit more crazed than usual. Did the Mini-Mario commercial brainwash him or something?  Either way, if your intepretation of DK is based on those games, then you must have some pretty high standards for being considered a hero. Otherwise, I don't see why you, me and the DKU can't have differing viewpoints on what the character should be like. Isn't that the way it's supposed to be? That doesn't make Mario selfish, it makes him a player! Then I guess DK's want for bananas means he's just really hungry, not selfish. |
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Post by Koopaul on Nov 19, 2008 21:43:12 GMT -5
"Donkey help K. Lumsey."
If I remember correctly, K. Lumsey was a Kremling trapped by K. Rool who seemed to offer nothing for the Kongs and asked for DK's help. DK willingly agreed to help K. Lumsey despite having just met.
Anyway... Does trying to recover something stolen from you make you selfish?
Evidence points that the fruit DK recovers in Jungle Beat is not his to recover. Its random giant fruit sprouting from a tree.
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Post by Hiker of Games on Nov 19, 2008 22:08:11 GMT -5
I think the point they're trying to make is not that DK is selfish (like Wario), but that he isn't selfless (like Mario). He's an easy going Kong that way. It's worth noting that as far as DK:JB depicting DK as a colossal asshole is entirely up to the player. You don't HAVE to get the first punch in. But once those bosses do attack, DK is only pummeling to oblivion out of self defense. |
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Post by Arcadenik on Nov 19, 2008 22:08:45 GMT -5
I seem to recall one crime that happened to me 2 years ago. I was walking down the street minding my business and chatting on my phone when three black teenagers grabbed my phone from my hand and ran off with it. I chased them down the street and a hispanic group of teenagers in a truck witnessed it and steered the truck around to block their way. They were cornered and I jumped on one of them, strangled his neck and bit his forehead, and one of his friends jumped on my back and tried to get me off the guy I was mauling. The police came and got the guy off me then had to pry me off the other guy. I got my phone back. It doesn't make me selfish. I was rightfully furious over the attempted robbery! Maybe you guys don't believe it but it really did happen. So I can imagine how DK felt when his bananas were stolen over and over!
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Post by Hiker of Games on Nov 19, 2008 22:14:50 GMT -5
I seem to recall one crime that happened to me 2 years ago. I was walking down the street minding my business and chatting on my phone when three black teenagers grabbed my phone from my hand and ran off with it. I chased them down the street and a hispanic group of teenagers in a truck witnessed it and steered the truck around to block their way. They were cornered and I jumped on one of them, strangled his neck and bit his forehead, and one of his friends jumped on my back and tried to get me off the guy I was mauling. The police came and got the guy off me then had to pry me off the other guy. I got my phone back. It doesn't make me selfish. I was rightfully furious over the attempted robbery! Maybe you guys don't believe it but it really did happen. So I can imagine how DK felt when his bananas were stolen over and over! In your story, you were acting out of self-interest. It was your phone being stolen. Does that make you selfish? No. Does that make you selfless? No. Had it been some other person's phone and you chased them down in the same exact way, then it would be a selfless act. To sum up. The three black teenagers: acted selfishly The hispanic teenagers: acted selflessly You: acted in self-interest The idea that's being argued here (and somewhat pointlessly at that) is that: Wario: acts selfishly Mario: acts selflessly DK: acts in self-interest |
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Post by Arcadenik on Nov 19, 2008 22:45:18 GMT -5
Wario = acts selfishly
Mario = acts selflessly
DK = acts in self-interest
This, I can agree with!
DK acted out of self-interest when he went after Pauline and the banana hoard. He wanted Pauline to like him and to have his banana collection back home.
Wario acted selfishly when he went to save Kitchen Island, Music Box World, the Golden Pyramid, and the Shake Dimension only because he wanted their treasures.
Mario acted selflessly when he went out to save Peach and Daisy, and saved the world from Bowser, Cackletta, the Shroobs, the Smithy Gang, the X-Nauts, and Count Bleck without asking nor expecting to be rewarded for it!
Now, what about Yoshi? Selflessly saving the babies and turning the island back to normal after it was turned into a book?
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Post by TV Eye on Nov 19, 2008 23:06:07 GMT -5
I seem to recall one crime that happened to me 2 years ago. I was walking down the street minding my business and chatting on my phone when three black teenagers grabbed my phone from my hand and ran off with it. I chased them down the street and a hispanic group of teenagers in a truck witnessed it and steered the truck around to block their way. They were cornered and I jumped on one of them, strangled his neck and bit his forehead, and one of his friends jumped on my back and tried to get me off the guy I was mauling. The police came and got the guy off me then had to pry me off the other guy. I got my phone back. It doesn't make me selfish. I was rightfully furious over the attempted robbery! Maybe you guys don't believe it but it really did happen. So I can imagine how DK felt when his bananas were stolen over and over! I...I... I need a hug. |
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