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Post by Deleted on Sept 8, 2007 22:13:35 GMT -5
In the previous SSB's, a character's alternate costume was just a color variation. Now I'm thinking, could an alternate costume be a variation of the character, such as Paper Mario and Doctor Mario being alternate costumes of Mario? And Daisy being an alternate costume of Peach?
And, if Olimar joins, could an alternate costume be Louie or the President?
So, what about your thoughts?
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Post by Savage Adam on Sept 8, 2007 22:16:31 GMT -5
Is that message under your avitar refering to me?
And I think that would be a good idea.
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Post by TV Eye on Sept 8, 2007 22:23:01 GMT -5
Mario = Dr. Mario
Link = Young Link
Zelda = Sheik
Samus = Dark Samus
Fox = Falco
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Post by Deleted on Sept 8, 2007 22:25:33 GMT -5
Is that message under your avitar refering to me? And I think that would be a good idea. Yes, it does. I'm keeping it, and if I change my avatar, than this kitty's goin in my sig. Sorry to tell you that  And TVeye, that's a great idea! This may very well be our explaination to Zelda-Shiek situation! |
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Post by NinjaRygar on Sept 9, 2007 1:25:15 GMT -5
Drastic design changes can't work. You can't change a character's hit boxes just to change the costume....
That's why Paper Mario can't be an alternate costume for Mario. Paper Mario has a different voice first of all, he's shorter, and lacks a whole dimension... does that sound like a different costume or a different character?
If one costume has an advantage over another costume... you're looking at a completely broken game. This idea gets thrown around alot... and I support the idea! But these DRASTIC changes are NOT possible.
Adding a hat, or a different shirt, or shoes, that's possible... which is why it's possible to make Peach look like Daisy or change the logo on captain falcon's back. But to change Link's design from Twilight Princess into Ocarina of Time would make him a different character. Why? His animations have to be totally redone. I mean his new face and body can't work with the animations programmed for his default one... they have to do it all over again! That's a different character... not a different costume.
Sheik as a different costume for Zelda? Can you imagine Shiek's design just maked on Zelda's animations? You're talking about making him stand there like a princess and do light magical hand waves and short kicks... instead of his (her) lightning fast acrobatics. This is not a good idea. Plus the announcer has to say something different for her name, she has to have her own voice.... might as well make Sheik his/her own character!
Young Link being a costume for Link? You don't have to try hard to think why that's a bad idea.
People sometimes suggest that different costumes have different moves... I kindly ask them to RETHINK this. If a character has even ONE different move/animation (Dr. Mario for example) it's a DIFFERENT character... and may have advantages/disadvantages against OTHER costumes... which is something you want to completely avoid in a fighting game.
Different costumes are a great idea. Like Dr. Mario as a costume... that WORKS. Just change his clothes... that doesn't affect hitboxes or animations at all. It's a small detail. Peach can look like Daisy and Samus can probably even look like Dark Samus. But turning Fox into falco? Paper Mario, Young Link, Cel Shaded Link, 8-bit mario, N64 Mario, Pauline, Krystal, Raichu, 2nd and third generation starters.... these are TERRIBLE ideas for costumes. And I hear them all the time.
This does not apply to Pokemon trainer though... since he can look like whatever... he's not actually in the fight. They can make him look like May or Dawn or Brock or anybody... he's an avatar. The Pokemon themsevles can't change though. Which is why Blaziken can't be a "costume " for charizard ect ect...
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Post by Smashchu on Sept 9, 2007 1:37:43 GMT -5
I kind of summed Rygar post, but I agree for the most part. Somwe alts are OK, but if you ever noticed, all were within the realm of color changes. Dr. Mario for Mario could work, but all the other have different hitboxes, or are really goofy (Sheik uses the same attacks as Zelda. WHAT?).
I'm against Alt. Coustums. For the most part, I like just the colors. Simple./ The coustumes don't do it for me. Some alts are fine, but lets not go overboard.
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Post by Hiker of Games on Sept 9, 2007 9:28:57 GMT -5
Costumes don't necessarily have to be different characters either. Slap Link's magical armor on. Or hell, just make him completely black and give us Dark Link. Giving Wario his classic outfit would be a great costume idea. Give us old Solid Snake or maybe Liquid Snake.Putting Z-Suit Samus in her outfit from the best ending of Super Metroid would be an even BETTER costume idea.
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Post by TV Eye on Sept 9, 2007 9:50:07 GMT -5
Good point.
The Wario one would be a good idea (with the overalls). But I just put Young Link and Sheik in there to make the fans happy. I knew it wasn't possible (could it?).
Anyways, Dark Samus would work. It's just a color change after all, and that's what they normally do. As for Dr. Mario, They would have to redo all the animations with a whole new character. They wouldn't do that.
So...I don't know. We'll just have to see if the creators are up to it.
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Post by kirbychu on Sept 9, 2007 9:52:53 GMT -5
They wouldn't have to redo animations for Dr. Mario... the only animation that was different between Mario and Dr. Mario in Melee was his taunt.
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Post by TV Eye on Sept 9, 2007 10:11:16 GMT -5
They wouldn't have to redo animations for Dr. Mario... the only animation that was different between Mario and Dr. Mario in Melee was his taunt. Well, he has entirely different clothes on. He's got the doctor's outfit, which would not look right just colored over on his overalls. His suit blows in the wind too and moves when he moves (it has physics). Seems like a lot of work just for an alt. costume. |
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Post by Hiker of Games on Sept 9, 2007 10:12:36 GMT -5
Changing costumes like giving him his doctor outfit isn't that big of a deal. Soul Calibur II gives the characters some pretty drastic costume changes - that doesn't effect gameplay at all.
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Post by TV Eye on Sept 9, 2007 10:15:49 GMT -5
Changing costumes like giving him his doctor outfit isn't that big of a deal. Soul Calibur II gives the characters some pretty drastic costume changes - that doesn't effect gameplay at all. I would be very happy if they did give him the Dr. Mario costume. My point is though that they won't. Or they might. We are unsure what Nintendo is capable of doing at the moment, but they just don't seem like adding a new character as a costume. |
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Post by Spud on Sept 9, 2007 11:10:38 GMT -5
They wouldn't have to redo animations for Dr. Mario... the only animation that was different between Mario and Dr. Mario in Melee was his taunt. Well, he has entirely different clothes on. He's got the doctor's outfit, which would not look right just colored over on his overalls. His suit blows in the wind too and moves when he moves (it has physics). Seems like a lot of work just for an alt. costume. It's actually not that hard to do. You add 3 or 4 little dress armatures and there you have it, they can be with Mario even when he's not Dr. Mario, I mean In melee's debug mode you could hit up on the control pad to make Peach's dress disappear while still viewing the armatures. So not so much work really. |
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Post by Manspeed on Sept 9, 2007 12:33:59 GMT -5
Well.... in the realms of costumes, some suitable ones would be:
Mario: Dr.Mario
DK: DK Classic (no tie, different hairdo)
Link: Magic Armor, Dark Link
Samus: Fusion Suit
Yoshi: Boshi
Kirby: Shadow Kirby
Fox: Falco (if he can't be de-cloned), Wolf, SFA uniform, SFSNES uniform
Pikachu: More extra hats or other accessories
Ness: Ninten, Lucas
Captain Falcon: Blood Falcon, Mach Rider (it's a stretch, though)
Peach: Nurse Toadstool
Marth: Sigurd, maybe some other Lords
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Post by Hiker of Games on Sept 9, 2007 16:37:26 GMT -5
Ganondorf could alternate from his original beardless self in OoT as well as getting the robe (but not the preggers) of his TWW outfit.
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