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Post by Wildcat on Nov 3, 2009 23:51:21 GMT -5
I eagerly await a new Nintendo mash-up, outside of fighting. A RPG, platformer, action game...there's so many cool possibilities. Brawl had the right idea, but didn't provide a full meal. More like...an appitezier. A taste of how incredibly awesome this concept could be. I would fully support taking it up a notch, whatever it may be.
Ridley is most deserving of his boss slot(s). The Emissary newbies, on the other hand, were not. Any number of Nintendo bosses could have been better and more fitting than Tabuu and his uncreative cronies. ROB was fine, and I dug the true Ninty bosses that made an appearance, but to not have a single Zelda boss was a shock. Imagine Andross, the Black Knight from Path of Radiance, or Medusa from Kid Icarus sneaking in. Man, now I'm getting all mopey again. XD
At any rate, like I said at LVLs., nice article, TEi. It's certainly something to think about, and while it hasn't spiraled into every series that I'd like, there does seem to be some influence on Nintendo's decisions thanks to Smash Bros. titles.
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Post by Da Robot on Nov 4, 2009 0:46:19 GMT -5
From what I'm heard, the real game that help Nintendo to decide to bring FE to the west was actually Advance Wars.
Why?
Because it showed that there was an audience for turn based strategy games.
Also Nintendo had been wanting to revive PO on the N64 and GCN but couldn't come up with any new ideas for the games, the only reason it came to Wii was because of the motion controls.
Also similiar to above Metroid didn't get a N64 game due to not having any new ideas for the platform.
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Post by parrothead on Nov 4, 2009 2:07:52 GMT -5
Cross-posted over at LVLs.One thing I love about the Smash Bros. games is how their effect on old/obscure/dried-up franchises is nigh magical; the series has rejuvenated so many of those franchises that it's almost silly, bringing both big and small titles back from the brink. The fact that Smash Bros. games are pretty much advertisements for what Nintendo has to offer helps, of course (I got into WarioWare and Pikmin because of Brawl), but the truth is out there, friends, and it dates back to the very first installment of the series. Most fans nowadays want it to be like "Everything VS. Everything", featuring the world's most popular characters from all different popular types of media. I think it is best to keep it all Nintendo and nothing else, unless if Nintendo plans to make a cross-over game like "Nintendo VS. Gainax". When I first heard of M.U.G.E.N, and after I saw several cross-overs from the official Namco X Capcom, to the fan-made Data East X Sunsoft, I thought of and I am still searching and downloading as many protagonists/main icons and stages of video games by different developers as possible to create some MUGEN videos that make good sense. Samus is a prime (heh) example here; by the time SSB on the N64 rolled around, Nintendo's first bounty hunter/mercenary/whatever they want her to be this week had only had three games, the last of which emerging five years prior to SSB's debut. Metroid games have always been great, but Samus' inclusion in SSB - which had been a long shot and a surprising choice at the time - really put her on the map, because three years following the first Smash Bros. game (and eight years since Super Metroid), two new Metroid games launch side-to-side: Metroid Prime and Metroid Fusion. From here, the Metroid franchise just fucking took off like a rocket; Prime would receive two sequels (and then a compilation of all three games) and two spin-offs, the original Metroid would be released in the GBA as part of the Classic NES Series and then remixed for the GBA title Metroid Zero Mission, and in the future we have Metroid: Other M to look forward to. Metroid and Samus went from being franchise underdogs to absolute power players in the Nintendo market, becoming one of their biggest, most dominating franchises, especially amongst the western audiences. Perhaps a show of this strength can be found in Super Smash Bros. Brawl, being one of the few series represented by more than one new stage and carrying a massive, largely remixed song set - not to mention the inclusion of Zero Suit Samus as an additional character (a design first introduced in Metroid Zero Mission and teased at in the original Metroid game with the Justin Bailey code), and two boss characters in The Subspace Emissary. When I was very young, I wasn't interested in the Metroid series, because I couldn't understand why it was popular. I didn't hear anyone say things like "It's the first to do this kind of thing!" However, I remember renting Super Metroid and thought it was quiet, until I encountered a boss that scared me (forgot what it was), while Samus died and showed me that she was female for the first time in my life. To learn about the Metroid series before the Internet became larger, I started playing the first few Metroid games before proceeding with Fusion, Prime 1 and Prime Hunters. I still haven't got Prime 2 nor 3, but I might get the Prime Trilogy. The Earthbound/MOTHER series has received a much lower degree of success, Ness being largely unknown to gamers by the time the first Smash Bros. came about, but the amount of popularity it's garnered hasn't hurt. Unfortunately, Nintendo doesn't seem intent to bring the love to the Western audience, what with a lack of Earthbound on the Virtual Console and a translated version of MOTHER 3. But Ness (and now Lucas) are known characters, whereas Western audiences would have absolutely no idea if Ness hadn't been acknowledge in Super Smash Bros. I first heard of the MOTHER/EarthBound series in a GamePro issue when my brother was subscribed to it. At first, I wasn't into RPGs yet back then, but I was interested in video games, especially Nintendo-related. Ness appearance in SSB64 was one of the things that caused me to become interested in seeing lesser-known video games. This also made me start with Starmen.Net's forum as the first Internet forum I joined. Right now, I'm not as interested in the MOTHER/EarthBound series as I once was, because the series now reminds me of making some bad decisions at Starmen.Net's forum that caused some people to hate me. And let's not forget Captain Falcon and the F-Zero franchise; due to the good Captain's inclusion in Smash Bros., the F-Zero series boomed, receiving several GBA spin-off titles (of dubious quality) and (a rarity for Nintendo franchises) an anime in its honor (also of dubious quality, but hey, it's sort of flattering I guess). While there haven't been many mainstream F-Zero games (only three overall), Captain Falcon's continued presence in Smash Bros. titles and his immense popularity amongst fans (mostly as a meme, but still) guarantees that F-Zero will continue to live on in some form or another. When tokusatsu-style F-ZERO racer appeared in the SSB series, most people thought he never fought before. I remember hearing the Irate Gamer saying "So why am I even fighting here? Is there a specific reason for this? I guess there could be an explanation in the instruction manual. But the hell with that! Whoever reads those things anyway! I can't waste my time reading about a game I just gotta play it!" Me and my brother were the same way. We were too lazy to read manuals, because we thought they were useless. I also remember numerous rental stores like Blockbuster Video and pawn shops selling games without manuals. The manual for the SNES F-ZERO helps prove that Captain Falcon did fight before the SSB series was created. The anime cut itself off outside of Japan when half of it's entire episodes were done, because of numerous fans of Captain Falcon, F-ZERO, SSB and Nintendo wanted to see Captain Falcon be the main character instead of Ryu Suzaku/Rick Wheeler. Fans also uploaded the scene where Captain Falcon does his Falcon Punch against Black Shadow, just to enjoy what many consider to be the best part of the anime, because at first glance, they thought the massive explosion was caused by his Falcon Punch, but was actually a reactor going off. Even after fans noticed the reactor actually causing the explosion, they still don't care and want to believe that Captain Falcon is one of the strongest (if not, the strongest) video game characters in existence. Then comes Super Smash Bros. Melee, where three largely unheard-of franchises come to light: Ice Climber, Fire Emblem and Game & Watch. In the cases of the first and third, much like Earthbound, the most to happen was raise fan-based awareness; thanks to Melee, Nintendo fans who didn't know better could associate Game & Watch to the company, providing a greater interest in the series, and Ice Climber, like the original Metroid, received a port in the Classic NES Series on the GBA. Ice Climber was usually looked by many as just another video game. Fire Emblem was of course, a then-Japan exclusive franchise. Game & Watch was the original series of LCD handheld games popular in Japan, but pretty much a fad outside of Japan that was overshadowed by their widely known competitor that ripped them off: the LCD handhelds by Tiger Electronics. Another main reason why Nintendo added the Game & Watch franchise is to pay tribute to Gunpei Yokoi after he passed away. Shortly after he passed away, Nintendo immediately developed and released Game & Watch Gallery 1 to pay tribute to him. While fans in Japan wanted more, Nintendo hired TOSE to develop the later titles, due to Nintendo not having enough time and effort to do the sequels, until Game & Watch Collection 1 and 2 and the DSiWare versions. Fire Emblem, however, managed to walk away the winner of those three; previously a Japan-only series, Nintendo took a gambit by including Marth and Roy in the US, European and Australian releases. While there was an ulterior motive involved (promoting Fire Emblem 6 and it's US debut, thanks to Roy's inclusion in Melee), the gambit ultimately succeeded as now Fire Emblem has a place amongst English-speaking countries and has seen numerous sequels in the time since Melee's release. Marth's presence in both Melee and Brawl also increased awareness of him as a character; this, I'm sure, is what prompted Nintendo to re-make the original Fire Emblem for the Nintendo DS, with spiffy new graphics and everything. When I first saw Marth in SSBM, I thought he was the protagonist of The Castle and its sequel, Castlequest (known in Japan as Castle Excellent), but forgot that they were developed by ASCII Corporation. For Roy, I had nothing to say or think until an issue of Nintendo Power (a magazine I was subscribed to back then) explained to me about them, and caused me to order Fire Emblem: The Binding Blade through eBay. I still haven't beat it, due to trying to keep everyone in the game from dying. I was hoping for The Binding Blade to be released outside of Japan, but Nintendo of America decided to start with The Blazing Sword. I couldn't gain interest in this franchise due to how difficult most games are. And then, there's Brawl. In this case, it's mostly the Assist Trophies that do the advertising here, but a couple playable characters also contribute: - Pit has skyrocketed the general awareness of the Kid Icarus series, although we have yet to see a new installment to the franchise
- Little Mac's inclusion has spurned a new Punch-Out!! title after so many years of idling
- Saki, in tandem with the Virtual Console translation of the original Sin & Punishment some years after it's Japanese release, has drawn attention to the series and allowed a world-wide release of S&P2
- Lucas and Porky have further promoted MOTHER, particularly MOTHER3 (irritating western gamers with a Japanese-only release for the title)
- To a lesser extent, Jeff increased awareness of Earthbound
- Olimar's presence cements the Pikmin series as a power player
- People actually know who R.O.B. is now
- Starfy being an Assist Trophy has finally brought the titular character's series to the west
- And finally, Isaac's presence has spurned a new Golden Sun game.
It just goes to show how much weight and power a multi-franchise crossover fighting game can sling around. I agree that some characters were brought back for advertising purposes (Little Mac, Saki, Starfy, etc.), while some as tributes to the eras and franchises they are from (Pit, R.O.B.). Little Mac's original NES look was used to fit with the Wii remake of the NES Punch-Out!! titles. Before that, Nintendo was currently using his SNES look, not only to help advertise the GCN version of EA's Fight Night Round 2, but also due to the SNES Super Punch-Out!! being the then-newest of the Punch-Out!! series. If you still don't think the SNES boxer is Little Mac, because his official name was never announced during its original release, then how come Meta Knight was originally nameless and gets a name in a localized version of a Puyo Puyo game? |
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Post by Fryguy64 on Nov 4, 2009 6:10:34 GMT -5
The comment about characters being used to advertise upcoming games is an important one.
I have long been of the opinion that Kirby was overpowered in SSB64, but then he was about to appear in Kirby 64. By Melee he was made a little less powerful and a little more easier to KO. By Brawl he was stronger again, and joined by Meta Knight and Dedede, plus a Halberd stage, just before the remake of Kirby Super Star.
I don't think these things are coincidence.
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Post by 8bitretroshit on Nov 4, 2009 10:21:06 GMT -5
I kinda doubt they'd intendedly make a character stronger for sake of advertising instead of trying to make a balanced fighting game.
But hey what do I know?
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Post by Shrikeswind on Nov 4, 2009 15:33:14 GMT -5
Enough to know Bubbles is a bad-ass in shades, and that's enough.
Seriously, Kirby's power was kinda ridiculous in Smash 64 because, well, it was the first try and Kirby didn't want to suck, so he pumped himself up to ridiculous proportions. The guys in charge didn't like that too much because they felt he was too strong, as a majority of the other fighters petitioned. When Melee came out, they told Kirby he could come if he toned himself down. But then he came in mediocre because he kept eating too much and getting sick, so for Brawl they pushed him into a gym. Kirby promptly ate the gym. So they tried hiring a trainer. He ate the trainer. Eventually they sat down and said "Okay, look, you got your butt kicked by Jigglypuff, get your butt moving." He then promptly ate Mewtwo. Mewtwo didn't like being in Kirby's belly, so he Trick Roomed the trainer into taking his place as Kirby's gut-monkey before Teleporting out of Kirby's digestive tract. And for those wondering, Kirby's anatomy allows for the survival of anything inside him. This is also why Mewtwo wasn't in Brawl: Having escaped Kirby's gut, Mewtwo headed back to the Cerulean Cave, where a Kadabra gave him the mail, including his invitation. He promptly readdressed it and sent it to Lucario so Kirby wouldn't realize that he had left his stomach.
And while that story is made up and pretty damn stupid, with a touch of reality it makes sense: The programmers wanted Kirby strong, but they ended up accidentally making him too strong the first time around, then nerfing him too much for Melee. In Brawl, they averaged him out.
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Post by Johans Nidorino on Nov 4, 2009 23:39:42 GMT -5
It's possible that Sakurai has had a special fondness for Jigglypuff, making it fly like Kirby and using green team Jigglypuff to reference Noddy. I'm not sure if Jigglypuff's inclusion in Smash influenced future games much, but we see a brief scene during the Pokémon Gold & Silver opening sequence that shows Jigglypuff singing before Pikachu appears and attacks it. Then again, Jigglypuff was in the opening sequence in Pokémon Blue, too. I was about to mention the special Game Boy Color that contains Jigglypuff, Togepi and Pikachu, but it happens to have been released in 1998 (Japan's Pokémon Yellow release year). Back to Kirby, don't forget how the Gourmet Race song is heard at Nightmare in Dream Land's Fountain of Dreams just like in Melee. Though this is not so surprising because both games have HAL as a link. |
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Post by Boo Destroyer on Nov 4, 2009 23:53:34 GMT -5
The Kirby series' direction at this point is very bleak. At this point, I'm struggling to erase Kirby Wii from my memory, that is until anybody brings it up. <.> Okay, so maybe it's just me, but the recent handheld releases in this series have been rather monotonous. Super Star Ultra was great, but when you put it all into perspective...bluh...  So to put it in simplest terms (yet rather blunt), HAL lost their dick with the Kirby games ages ago. |
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Post by Fryguy64 on Nov 5, 2009 6:17:24 GMT -5
So to put it in simplest terms (yet rather blunt), HAL lost their dick with the Kirby games ages ago. I think what you mean is HAL lost their Sakurai. He was in charge of the series and then went off and started his own company to work on other things. Anything following that has basically mean mimicking his work. But I enjoyed Amazing Mirror and Power Paintbrush. I still haven't played Mouse Attack (using the UK names to screw with everyone) but is it really all that bad? You have to remember, Kirby's first game was piss easy, but hugely popular. The high point of the series was clearly KSS, but there's a lot of love for the games that followed. I must admit to not really enjoying KDL3 or Kirby 64 all that much, as they felt like a step back from the more epic adventures in KSS. Also, I really don't care for Dark Matter as a final boss. I think it's just one of those things where the game peaked early. Although a KSS-style game with the animal friends (Rick, Kine, Coo, etc.) is probably overdue by now! I love those guys. |
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Post by nocturnal YL on Nov 5, 2009 9:43:17 GMT -5
Squeak Squad is not too bad. It's just too short and doesn't have much replay value. You can get three 100% save files in a short time, after which you can have nothing new in it. On the other hand,
Amazing Mirror has you roam the place a bit and that's quite some time to find everything (and deactive the sparkling light on every door, although that doesn't count to the clear %) in the game. Which is why it sounds mor eenjoyable than the later games. Also, this one is still considered a "Sakurai Kirby" or at least "semi-Sakurai Kirby" since he oversaw the progress.
I think the first Kirby is the most difficult one. Everything after that have convenient save features. And the inconvenient physics engine does not help.
I have to agree with BD. If anything...
NINTENDO LIED BIG, FOR FOUR YEARS AND COUNTING.
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Post by Dasher Misire on Nov 5, 2009 18:14:31 GMT -5
F-Zero's anime is one of the best game animes I have ever seen, even more than Fate/Stay Night and Hoshi no Kirby. If you watch the whole thing (there used to be full English subs but now we have to settle for Engrish and some good annotation ones for the last ten episodes on Youtube), there are scenes COOLER than the final episode's Death Race and reactor fight. Like Falcon coming out of hiding as the enigmatic soldier for Black Shadow, as Mute CIty blares in the background and he and Ryu escape on the Falcon Flyer that looks like it came out of a Tomino movie. As for Kirby, I loved Squeak Squad. First Kirby game I really enjoyed without Sakurai's involvement or the title of a remake. It had fun levels, copy powers, and enemies. It was just very short and lacked replay value. The fact it's been three years since a new Kirby game, though, makes me worry for the series' future. Not to mention how they torture us as BD and YL pointed out with a promise for a new title in my favorite game series. That looked to do it justice.  |
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Post by Boo Destroyer on Nov 6, 2009 13:56:38 GMT -5
If you still don't think the SNES boxer is Little Mac, because his official name was never announced during its original release, then how come Meta Knight was originally nameless and gets a name in a localized version of a Puyo Puyo game? Hate to come off like this, but Parrot, there's something that you gotta understand here... While a lot of things sure do get official, definite names, there are also other things that just don't. It happens. Even if anything doesn't have an official name doesn't mean hope is lost on it. Just call them (usually) whatever they're supposed to be. Or if you're really feeling up for it, in fact, there's nothing wrong with fan-naming something (just as long as it's fair enough to make sure the majority rolls with it). This especially compensates for NOA's (and depends, even NOJ's) lack of interest on these things. I even tried this sort of thing with several yet-unnamed Mario and (even moreso) Wario series enemies. So the SNES Punch-Out guy just wasn't named, and Meta Knight then was. Simple as that. It just happens. (I don't think that "Revenge of _________" would hold over too well, do you?) |
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Post by kirbychu on Nov 7, 2009 15:28:03 GMT -5
Mouse Attack was my favourite Kirby game since Super Star. Mainly because it was the first game since then to actually feel like part of the same series as Super Star.
I loved Kirby 64, but it wasn't anything like what I was hoping for. I found Amazing Mirror kind of boring, and I didn't like Air Ride at all. Power Paintbrush was good, but not really a Kirby game... and then Mouse Attack came along, and was short, but was more fun than I'd had with a Kirby game in like ten years.
But now I have Super Star Ultra, which is my favourite Kirby game plus new things. Best ever.
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Post by Hiker of Games on Nov 7, 2009 15:43:32 GMT -5
Squeak Squad was a pretty good game, all around. But yeah, short.
I enjoyed Kirby 64 though. Just the ridiculous amount of combinations you could get for powers made it so the game never got boring. My Darth Maul-style lightsaber was so awesome.
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Post by Prince~Of~Light on Dec 17, 2009 10:40:19 GMT -5
Actually, I REALLY agree with WildCat. Aside from fighting, we could see Nintendo characters do something else and actually IN CANON. (No moar throphy characters, just the real canon characters we know from the games.)
RPG could work, if given any ideal twist. SSB-like battles might take the place of turn-based battles.
It could like SubSpace Emissary, but it's an RPG now.
Action game? I wonder what kind of, makes me think of Zelda a bit. (-ll-)
Platformer game would be VIVIDLY Nintendo. (As Nintendo has a lots platformers.)
Also, ]Mushroom Kingdon Fusion?
Party-game sounds good too- If they were to pull one, something like Mario Partyc and not like Crash Bash, they might make characters Balloon Fight or Wes Dance in order to open a door. (-lwl-)
Plus, include ALL minigames (No WarioWare) Nintendo has made in any game. (Mario Party has a gigantic collection, Pokemon Stadium sounds good too, Thunder Dynamo FTW,
some classic games made into minigames, etc)
For those games to not have like 60 characters, they must either center on popular franchises, or obscure franchises and make a mashup game from them.
(-lwl-)
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