|
|
Post by Fryguy64 on Feb 8, 2007 18:51:26 GMT -5
Johnny Five is not a robot... JOHNNY FIVE IS ALIVE!! ;D For all we know, Zoda was named in both games by the same person, because it was a cool alien name they thought up years ago (for Star Tropics). Even if that were the case, unless it's an intentional reference to Star Tropics - and all evidence points to not - then it will not count as a cameo on NinDB. If the NES ROB was the first and only robot ever to be called ROB, then people who name robots are REALLY STUPID.  |
|
|
|
Post by Da Robot on Feb 8, 2007 19:11:54 GMT -5
I just googled Rob the robot and it came with a industral robot named ROB 310 Three Axis robot and another one by the same company called the ROB 320. So it does look like there at least is some robot with the name ROB in this world.
Message to Fryguy
Confirm the second F-zero cameo and end this thread now!!!
|
|
|
|
Post by kirbychu on Feb 8, 2007 19:19:59 GMT -5
According to Wikipedia ROB64 is called NUS64 in Japan. Is that just more wiki idiocy, or is there more to it?
|
|
|
|
Post by Manspeed on Feb 8, 2007 19:29:56 GMT -5
I've never seen so many mentions of my name in one place. ;D
|
|
|
|
Post by Nester the Lark on Feb 8, 2007 19:51:25 GMT -5
Argue all you want - it's not going on NinDB ;D I never said it should. I just wanted to state my case, and I thought it was a touchy subject for you. Japan has been known to use names created by America in some cases, but it's not the fact ROB's name may have been adopted by Japan that's at issue - it's the fact ROB64 was created in Japan, a country where Famicom Robot has never been referred to as ROB, there is no physical similarity, and absolutely no further suggestion that ROB64 is a reference in any way. So either Nintendo EAD created ROB64 as a reference that nobody in their home market would ever understand, give them no clues and alter the appearance beyond recognition so that the in-joke will only be understood by Americans.... See, I don't understand why that's so out of the question. So what if it's a reference only Americans would understand? Their English-speaking audience is quite large. Or by simply applying the priciples of Occam's Razor, that the simplest explanation is often the best, the name is simply a coincidence brought about by the fact ROBOT is easily shortened to ROB for naming purposes. You may be right, but to me, it seems such an obvious reference, that's what seems to be the simplest explanation to me. For Zoda I apply this little equation: Yoda + Z = funky alien name ;D So Zoda being a reference to a previous Nintendo character name is less likely than someone who conveniently decided to spell Yoda with a Z? Just because he may not be the same character from Star Tropics doesn't mean the name itself didn't come from there. I'll admit I could easily be wrong about ROB, but saying someone unwittingly decided spell Yoda with a Z, and it just accidentally happened to be the same as another Nintendo character really seems like a stretch. Or we could apply Occam's Razor and say Nintendo re-used it for another F-Zero cross-game reference. Um... I think this has officially turned into a debate, now.  |
|
|
|
Post by Phil Bond on Feb 8, 2007 21:04:50 GMT -5
Fun fact: I wrote 90% of the ROB wiki page.
The cameo section is a source of annoyance, and the highly seperated Mariokart DS section is the result of an infuriating wiki-esque compromise. I've given up on keeping it perfect. Wikipedia is painful.
|
|
|
|
Post by Da Robot on Feb 8, 2007 21:50:02 GMT -5
That is a really good wiki page you made, expect for some of the cameo parts of it. Were you the one who added the Nintendo Power aritcle on R.O.B. about where he is today and it was there when berlin wall fell and stund double in Terminator and everything? Because that part sounds serilously cool.
|
|
|
|
Post by Fryguy64 on Feb 9, 2007 3:57:46 GMT -5
Hey Phil! ;D What is your take on all this then? Do you think people are looking for cameos in places where there are none?
Kirbychu - He is called ROB or ROB64 in Japan, but he HAS been referred to as NUS-064 before - mainly on his chest plate in SFAss. A reference, of course, to the N64's serial code. Not necessarily a reference to ROB-NES.
Corey - on Zoda, I said that already didn't I? For all we know the same guy came up with the name and used it for both Zodas - but that doesn't presuppose a cameo.
You are the archaeologist and I am the scientific community. The burden of proof is on you to provide me with convincing evidence that the unique bone you've discovered is from a new species of human, and not just the bone of an invalid or small child.
|
|
|
|
Post by Nester the Lark on Feb 9, 2007 11:53:26 GMT -5
Corey - on Zoda, I said that already didn't I? For all we know the same guy came up with the name and used it for both Zodas - but that doesn't presuppose a cameo. Why not? References come in all shapes and sizes. It's not like it would be the only reference in the game. Plus, James McCloud isn't a carbon copy of the Star Fox character either. Maybe they wanted to make it clear that the F-Zero universe is not the same as the Star Fox universe. If that's the case, it's probably not the same as the Star Tropics universe, ether. In both cases, the character is a reference, and nothing more. There's no rule that says it has to be elaborate. References can be subtle, too. I don't see your motivation for validating one and denying the other. Or maybe you're just sore that Zoda's Revenge was never officially released in Europe, and you're taking it out on a poor, innocent, killer alien racer. |
|
|
|
Post by Fryguy64 on Feb 9, 2007 13:10:41 GMT -5
You're just not making sense now ;D If we start right at the beginning we have two characters called Zoda who have no resemblance or obvious connections to each other beyond the name. We can either take one route and say it's JUST a coincidence, or we can take the other route and try to find ways the connection could be intentional. We have both posited the same theory that COULD prove a connection - that the name could have been assigned by the same person. But it's JUST a theory at the moment. Now, because I am a firm believer that it is nothing more than a coincidence, and you're a firm believe that it is an intentional reference, the burden of proof lies on you. What's beautiful is that I am a man of science. If you can actually find that proof, I will retract my belief in the coincidence and believe in your theory. You have not done that yet. Same goes for ROB. And so I shall not retract either belief just yet. I'm not above admitting there MIGHT be a connection. But I have to see it before I will believe it, and I have to believe it before I will add it to NinDB. That is the difference between Zoda and James McCloud. James might not be a "cameo appearance" per se, but it is an obvious and intentional reference - coincidences of that magnitude just do not happen. Two characters having the same name happens with a high frequency. Which is why, for a time, the cameo sections were called "cameos and references" - but it seemed redundant, so I cut it down. Apparently it wasn't  |
|
|
|
Post by Nester the Lark on Feb 9, 2007 16:33:55 GMT -5
Let me come at it from the other direction, then. In the case of other non-references, such as Octoman and Leon, they're debunked because the connections that form the references are generic and could apply to anything (except for Leon's mistaken species). But Zoda is anything but a generic name (unless it's a common name for aliens in Japan... is it?). I don't see how an alien character with the same unique and recognizable name as an alien character from another Nintendo series (who's name even appeared in one of the titles), and appears in a game that contains similar obvious and unique references, is not, itself, an obvious reference. As you put it, I just don't see a coincidence of that magnitude as being likely. (I mean, it's not like his name is Bob.) As you point out, we see it the same way, but I think our thresholds for what we consider obvious are different. Your argument for ROB 64 I can understand, but I honestly don't see your reasoning behind Zoda. I think, after careful consideration, I have come to the conclusion that we disagree. Let's have some cake. |
|
|
|
Post by Fryguy64 on Feb 9, 2007 17:09:55 GMT -5
Cake rules!! ;D The principle for Zoda and ROB is essentially the same. Nintendo may hide their cameos well, but I don't believe they have ever been very subtle about it. Two very distinct alien characters with the same name is a bit TOO subtle. It'd be a bit like featuring a character with no more than a moustache as a subtle reference to Mario. Not even fat or in red/blue or a plumber. Just a guy. It's not beyond the realm of possibility, but it's going to be very difficult to prove it is an intentional reference. Hence why I don't include the guy in Golf on the NES as a Mario reference |
|
|
|
Post by Nester the Lark on Feb 9, 2007 17:58:59 GMT -5
The principle for Zoda and ROB is essentially the same. Nintendo may hide their cameos well, but I don't believe they have ever been very subtle about it. I would agree with the slight ambiguity if it weren't for the context of the other F-Zero cameos. If Zoda was by himself, without James and EAD, I would have doubts. But in a line of other cameos, it just doesn't seem likely to me that they'd put such an obvious (to me) one in purely by accident. Two very distinct alien characters with the same name is a bit TOO subtle. It'd be a bit like featuring a character with no more than a moustache as a subtle reference to Mario. Not even fat or in red/blue or a plumber. Just a guy. You mean like Mr. EAD?  It's not beyond the realm of possibility, but it's going to be very difficult to prove it is an intentional reference. Hence why I don't include the guy in Golf on the NES as a Mario reference Well, NoA did (in the Mario Mania player's guide). Just to re-iterate, it's not my intention to make you change the website. Not at all. It's simply that I don't understand how something like that could be dismissed. It blows my mind. Just out of curiosity, does anyone else think it's as obvious as I do? I'm starting to feel like Juror #3 from "12 Angry Men". |
|
|
|
Post by kirbychu on Feb 9, 2007 18:09:14 GMT -5
You mean like Mr. EAD? Ah, but Mr. EAD was fat, had a Starman on his belt, and... was called Mr. EAD. |
|
|
|
Post by Dances in Undergarments on Feb 9, 2007 21:38:00 GMT -5
You mean like Mr. EAD? Thats exactly what I was going to say. |
|
