Clones Revisited

[Fryguy64]

This has been playing on my mind a little over the last couple of days. But do you think it's possible that clones might actually be a good idea in the end?

I mean, if you look over some of the most hotly debated characters here, Takamaru and Lucas, they could easily appear as clones. Takamaru has a sword, a bunch of item weapons, and is a young man adventurer. Could he not be a Link clone? Lucas could be a Ness clone. King Dedede could be a Kirby clone (for the most part - although copying would probably be removed). What about another Fire Emblem character?

Some of the clones from SSBM are also hugely popular - of course, which is why they were included in SSBM in the first place. Plus, I don't want to see a grown Tei cry because Falco's not in.

Suddenly it's seeming to me that the idea behind clones was sound, and could be used to expand upon the existing character roster without treading on the toes of available character slots.

What do you guys think? Maybe come up with some ideas for clones of your own!

[kirbychu]

I was never against clones, really. Two of my three main fighters in Melee were clones. But a lot of people feel cheated by it, and I can see why. The trouble is, you put in characters like Pichu and Young Link... if they're clones, people get annoyed that they don't have their own movesets... if they're not, people get annoyed that they were in over a more unique character. Catch 22.

[Deleted]

I always used to think Dedede would be an accurate Kirby clone, only slower, stronger, heavier and instead of using a Copy ability, his Suction powers are much stronger and can be used as a makeshift projectile attack. Kirby's Final Cutter would be replaced by a similar attack with Dedede's mallet that has more of an Area of Effect thing going, rather than creating a shockwave, and the Stone move would be replaced with that wicked Aerial Body Slam Dedede has from KDL.

I would also see Black Shadow taking Ganondorf's place as a Captain Falcon clone, since they're similar so far as build and stature are concerned. Besides, Ganondorf deserves his own moveset; it's not like he has a shortage of moves to draw on (unlike the other clones from Melee).

admin said:

Plus, I don't want to see a grown Tei cry because Falco's not in.

Oh, and I'll do it, too. It'll be like Darth Vader in Episode III, only I'd Force-implode Nintendo HQ instead of the medical ward I'd eventually wind up in.

[Johans Nidorino]

King Dedede can be given a mallet-throwing move, some stomping move, and gliding instead of Kirby's hops. A semi-clone in any case.

IMO, clones are okay while they don't corrupt too much the concept of a character or make it use too much made-up stuff like SSBM's Ganondorf.

There's creativity in finding a character from one universe who uses moves that emulate moves of a character from another universe, but there's more creativity in making a character with unique moves that are comfortable to use and come from the character's previous games.

[Hiker of Games]

I've always thought clones were great. My only issues had been with Dr. Mario and Ganondorf. But then, Ganondorf was an awesome player. His stats lended to the moveset better than Captain Falcon, ironically enough.

But otherwise, I've always wanted clones to come back. I was a bit disappointed when I heard talk of there being no clones at all. Although not a character who needs to be in Brawl, consider: Waluigi would make an excellent Luigi clone. He'd be taller and perhaps a bit slower and stronger. A common example I used to use was Tingle being a clone of Balloon Fighter - or vice versa.

Tei just had a brilliant idea though. If Ganondorf does get his own moveset, I'd LOVE to see Black Shadow take Falcon's moveset with Ganondorf's old stats. Wow. That would be awesome.

[Flint]

Yes, clones like Falco, Roy and Ganondorf are welcome (But now Ganondorf needs a brand new moveset, Falco could stay that way) but with clones like Dr. Mario. Young Link and Pichu is when I do (difrent version of an already existing character blaah!)

Both Takamaru and Mike Rogers could be Link clones (and in Mikes case he could also be a Ness clone)

Keep in mind that clones usually mind minor alterations to the original moveset and animations, when you start changing special moves it becames a Luigi.

now Clones that might work (and get my aproval)

Sheik = Tetra (and that way, we can get Sheik´s moveset back without having Zelda transform into her)
Ness = Lucas (even if I prefer if they gave Lucas Boney)
Ness = Mike
CP Falcon = Blaziken (fits like a globe)
Snake = Sami (even if in this case Sami should be the original)

Dedede and Takamaru should have a original moveset if they get in (or even better, they could make Takamaru and Mike share the moveset having one Japanese stock character being the clone of a American Stock character, and giving us both region exclusive characters.

Still i dont expect them to reveal characters that use to be clones in melee at least until the very end of the updates, because that would confirm that they have been declones/ stayed the same.

[Hiker of Games]

I wouldn't make Mike or Takamaru 'region exclusive'. But in Japan, Takamaru could be a starter and Mike a starter in US/Europe. Then it would appear the other is a clone of the so-called starter. And war will ensue!

[Arcadenik]

Young Link in Melee is a different version of Link in Melee because Young Link and Link are both based off OOT in which both are the same person.

However the most recent Zelda games portray Young Link and Link very differently. Link only has one game, TP, while Young Link has been in five: FS, TWW, FSA, TMC, and PH. That is more than enough to make Young Link in Brawl very different from Link in Brawl.

Really, the only clones I won't miss are Dr. Mario, Pichu, Roy, and Falco.

[Flint]

masamune said:

I wouldn't make Mike or Takamaru 'region exclusive'. But in Japan, Takamaru could be a starter and Mike a starter in US/Europe. Then it would appear the other is a clone of the so-called starter. And war will ensue!

I would be sad if there were region exclusive characters, even if its just a clone, I want to play with all of them .

arcadenik said:

Young Link in Melee is a different version of Link in Melee because Young Link and Link are both based off OOT in which both are the same person.

However the most recent Zelda games portray Young Link and Link very differently. Link only has one game, TP, while Young Link has been in five: FS, TWW, FSA, TMC, and PH. That is more than enough to make Young Link in Brawl very different from Link in Brawl.

Really, the only clones I won't miss are Dr. Mario, Pichu, Roy, and Falco.

Actually I want some Wind Waker/Four Swords/Phantom Hourglass representation in Brawl and would be really sad If everything Zelda is from TP (my least favorite game in the series) but thats a different topic entirely.

[Arcadenik]

Young Link has the potential to be cel-shaded like in TWW and his Final Smash could be temporarily splitting up into four Links like in FSA so it would be like four-character Ice Climbers instead of two-character Ice Climbers.

[Johans Nidorino]

If some-weird-how some young version of Link is in, then he'd probably still have a Spin Attack. And if that Link is the Hero of Winds one, then he'll probably have a Hurricane Spin Attack.

[Smashchu]

I see where your going with it. It's a gfood idea, but at the same time a bad one.

For characters like Falco and Lucas it could work very well. Falco veries greatly from his counter part where they can feel like two characters. This can also allow Roy to come back. It may overload Fire Emblem a bit, but the character is popular and makes a good alternat to Marth.

But the problem lies when you want to do it too much. In Melee, most of the clones were done just to have more characters. Not becuase they were unique or deseved a spot. If characters like Y. Link and Dr. Mario go, I'm fine. We also don't need to over justify it. Dedede coule be a Kirby clone, but he's got so many other moves to draw from that it wouldn't be hard to make a moveset, and some Kibry moves are a stretch. Same for making Takamaru a clone of someone, or the Mike/Takamru thing.

I'm OK with one or two. Even more so if they are more like Luigi,. but let's not go overboard with this.

[TV Eye]

The young Link in Melee was based off Majora's Mask, if I'm not mistaken.

Also, clones are okay (in Falco's case) but when you throw in Pichu who looks just like Pikachu, and does everything he does, except gets hurt when he misses an attack...that just sucks.

[Flint]

Yes, the Takamaru/Mike was probably streching it to much, to end the argument, Clones are a good way to espand the character roster, but if they abuse it, it feels cheap.

[Arcadenik]

Actually, Young Link in Melee was based off OOT in terms of character model and design (Deku Shield, Kokiri Shield).

Yet at the same time, Young Link used the Hookshot and the Bow in MM even though the Hookshot is based on the OOT design.

I would be very pleased if Young Link in Brawl got a makeover just like Link and Zelda - TWW Hero's Shield, TMC Four Sword, TWW Hero's Clothes, TMC Ezlo the hat, TWW Hookshot, TWW Fire & Ice Arrows, Four Links for Final Smash.

Pichu hurts himself even when he hits someone.