The Blue Bomber = Confirmed?

[Dances in Undergarments]

kirbychu said:

I don't have time to sit around with a bunch of fat pasty nerds and see who has the biggest virtual penis.

Because we all know I do. Oh wait, you said 'virtual'.

Also: Video Games. Serious Business.

[Fryguy64]

Videogames are a medium of entertainment, and this is how most people see them. Like watching a movie, or reading a book. It's not a waste of time to simply do these things for fun, as being entertained has been something mankind has done since the dawn of time.

The difference is, there's a more active role of participation. You learn skills and use them. Playing videogames is like playing board games. And some boardgames are taken very seriously indeed. But name me one professional chess player who, when playing against some random kid who isn't great at chess, uses every trick up their sleeve to win. And then calls that kid a n00b.

My issue isn't so much with people who use these skills in a professional tournament, so long as the rules allow. My issue is with the people who use these exploits in standard multiplayer. When I connect up to wifi to play a game online, I want a straightforward race to the finish, or a fight between two characters.

I don't want to watch as a "pro" who doesn't mind developing crippling arthritis by the age of 30 causes their character to perform peculiar feats of agility. I just want to play the damn game!

I have no doubt that online SSBB will be ruined for me by such people, who are only marginally better than people who use hax or cheat carts. After all... the aim is to win right? By any means necessary?

[8bitretroshit]

admin said:

I have no doubt that online SSBB will be ruined for me by such people, who are only marginally better than people who use hax or cheat carts. After all... the aim is to win right? By any means necessary?

Luckily for you there are no online records or boards. Not when playing versus strangers anyway. So basically people who want to go hardcore over wifi probably won't be playing the random opponent option that much. Ofcourse there will always be people who use Action Replay a few random matches, but without online scores it'll get old fast.

[TV Eye]

I'm sick of cheaters online. What's the point? To make your opponent hate you? To build up a score count? How important is the score count?

And Kirbychu, I agree with your statement. Videogames aren't life. And they are most certainly not mine. But sometimes, it's the only thing individuals are good at. They realize that skill and build up on it by finding loopholes and glitches. I play games when I am bored, and I love it. And when I go to college, I will take classes that have nothing too do with videogames or art (I figure its a lost cause, classes like that would be fucking crowded!)

Also, you don't need a girlfriend to have a life...

[Flip]

admin said:

Videogames are a medium of entertainment, and this is how most people see them. Like watching a movie, or reading a book. It's not a waste of time to simply do these things for fun, as being entertained has been something mankind has done since the dawn of time.

The difference is, there's a more active role of participation. You learn skills and use them. Playing videogames is like playing board games. And some boardgames are taken very seriously indeed. But name me one professional chess player who, when playing against some random kid who isn't great at chess, uses every trick up their sleeve to win. And then calls that kid a n00b.

My issue isn't so much with people who use these skills in a professional tournament, so long as the rules allow. My issue is with the people who use these exploits in standard multiplayer. When I connect up to wifi to play a game online, I want a straightforward race to the finish, or a fight between two characters.

I don't want to watch as a "pro" who doesn't mind developing crippling arthritis by the age of 30 causes their character to perform peculiar feats of agility. I just want to play the damn game!

I have no doubt that online SSBB will be ruined for me by such people, who are only marginally better than people who use hax or cheat carts. After all... the aim is to win right? By any means necessary?

Fry FTW.

VIDEO GAMES ARE SERIOUS BUSINESS

[Deleted]

I don't have much of a life (I work, sleep, play video games and look at pictures of a certain nature...that's really about it), but maybe it's because I dedicate so much time to games that Sploiters bother me. Wavedashing and snaking are very much the same thing to me--just some hyper-advanced exploit that people who are too uptight to lose call a technique in an excuse to pull out all the stops regardless of who they're playing against.

[dosv]

Wavedashing is not a glitch first of all. If I remember correctly somewhere on the Debug Menu you see the term "Waveland Special" used. So yes, Wavedahsing was either put in or or left in the game intentionally so there's really no way you can classify it as a glitch. Once again though, Snaking = something that furthers your goal in game. Wavedashing does not damage your opponent nor does it put them off the stage, so really it's nothing like Snaking.

Now about the taking video games serious piece. There is absolutely nothing wrong with playing a video game for fun. But you just said that no one should ever take it serious because it's a game, thats where you're wrong. You can try to justify your lack of skill at the game by telling others they have no life all you want. That's nothing more than a losers excuse or what we like to call a "John". It's not hard to have a life and only play a game 2 or 3 times a month BTW.

As far as people hacking or cheating at a Super Smash Bros. Melee Tournament, that's something I have yet to see even after playing competitively for a little over a year. IF by hacking you mean using advanced techniques like wavedashing, l-canceling, jump canceled grab, ect. then that is in no way how you describe it. All these techniques were left int he game on purpose and already after playing the Brawl demo at E for All a few people have confirmed the return of most of the adv. techs we used in Melee. Why do the Devs keep putting this stuff in the game if it's a glitch? I'd really like to know.

On another note, I can't name 1 professional smasher that would resort to any type of name calling after they beat someone who is not on par with them. I can name plenty of Halo players would would have no problem doing so. You can't really compare chess to the entire competitive video game community, especially since you'll find that most people who play the games on a competitive level don't play other games competitively unless it's a sequel or something similar. You can't group the Halo players with the SSBM players or any other gaming community.

[thores]

dosv said:

Wavedashing is not a glitch first of all. If I remember correctly somewhere on the Debug Menu you see the term "Waveland Special" used. So yes, Wavedahsing was either put in or or left in the game intentionally so there's really no way you can classify it as a glitch.

Glitch or no, wavedashing is no longer in Brawl, so Sakurai and the dev team obviously felt there was something gamebreaking about the technique.

dosv said:

As far as people hacking or cheating at a Super Smash Bros. Melee Tournament, that's something I have yet to see even after playing competitively for a little over a year. IF by hacking you mean using advanced techniques like wavedashing, l-canceling, jump canceled grab, ect. then that is in no way how you describe it. All these techniques were left int he game on purpose and already after playing the Brawl demo at E for All a few people have confirmed the return of most of the adv. techs we used in Melee. Why do the Devs keep putting this stuff in the game if it's a glitch? I'd really like to know

SOME techniques are still in, like shorthopping and some other stuff. But as previously mentioned, they took out wavedashing, and I think l-canceling is gone too.

Why are you even here, anyways? It seems like your sole purpose for joining was to yell at all the more casual Smash players that dwell here, and why even bother to do that? It doesn't bring us pleasure if you join with zero intention of getting along with us, and you're not going to change anybody's mind so I can't see your stay here bringing you anything but frustration. Unless, of course, I'm wrong about your motives for joining, in which case I apologize.

[dosv]

Directional Airdodge was taken out which was the only known method of Wavedashing in Melee. Wavelanding is still in, and so is float cancel for Peach. Combine the two and you now have a Peach that can wavedash. If any other Characters are able to double jump cancel their aerials then they can do it too. L-cancel is still in. It's been in since 64. Jump Canceled Grab is also still in. I don't really get how anyone can even be upset about wavedashing in Melee in the first place. Jump Canceled Grab is a far more broken technique. It allows 0 to death chain grabbing, and yes chain grabbing has returned in Brawl so we can all thank Sakurai for trying to take out something that added depth while leaving JCG in so characters like Mario can have an unfair advantage this time around.

My sole purpose for joining was not to yell at anyone, and I have not been doing so. I just happened to be reading over something when one of you said something that caught my eye. I'm not here to make casual players feel bad for doing anything, I'm just stating my opinion. Why isn't that ok? You guys see competitive Melee as players abusing glitches when in fact it's not that way. I'm merely trying to show you a competitive smasher's point of view. Of course you don't have to agree, but I still feel the need to say something.

[kirbychu]

dosv said:

My sole purpose for joining was not to yell at anyone, and I have not been doing so. I just happened to be reading over something when one of you said something that caught my eye. I'm not here to make casual players feel bad for doing anything, I'm just stating my opinion. Why isn't that ok? You guys see competitive Melee as players abusing glitches when in fact it's not that way. I'm merely trying to show you a competitive smasher's point of view. Of course you don't have to agree, but I still feel the need to say something.

Unfortunately we've already seen plenty of competitive smasher's points of view, and those points of view are usually "U GUYS R N00BS." Telling us it's not that way when we've already seen it to be the case is not going to convince anyone. And telling us we were wasting our time by not taking video games ULTRA SERIOUS didn't help your case at all, either.

[dosv]

I haven't called anywhere here a n00b or anything of the sort. I would never call somebody a name because I'm better at something than they are. I just feel like when you guys see professional players compete, you point out the most obvious to see technique and call it broken when wavedashing is not all that important to begin with anyway. Aniki = Top professional in Japan and yet he does not wavedash at all. He raped Ken with Link too. I just want you guys to realize Wavedash is not some "win button" or some form of cheating. It's just a tool that allows you to face forward while moving backwards a little bit or vice versa. Tools like that add more options, which adds more depth to the game as well. For God sakes we do not want another Super Smash Bros. 64. Thats what Brawl is starting to look like.


I feel like you don't read my posts at all. I said if there is anything you strive to be good at and you do not take is serious, then you are wasting your time. You yourself said that no games should be taken serious and I pointed out an example of when they should be. So unless you or anyone else here plans on being the best at Smash, then I am in no way telling you that you are wasting your time.

Also to whoever said it, I love your "fat pasty nerd" stereotyping. Unfortunately I don't see 1 smasher in this video that fits your stereotype.

MLG Vegas - P.c Chirs (Falco) vs Ken (Fox) Kongo Jungle 64
www.youtube.com/watch?v=pIPssvmCAG0

[8bitretroshit]

But I like Smash 64. It's so floaty~

Sure wavedash ain't a win button at all and I see how it would be fun to master and use it the best way possible and win tournament cash to pay the rent. But personally, and this is my own personal opinion here, I think wavedashing looks silly. But hey, I don't mind people wavedashing, I know one guy who tries to be all pro by wavedashing, only to air dodge off a stage. He also sucks balls on stages like Big Blue. I guess the reason why I mention this because there are quite a few people who call themselves 'pro' smashers who can chain grab like the best of 'em but are terrible on 'random' stages like Poke Floats, which is funny cause the stage follows the same pattern every time.
Also the whining about exploding capsules/crates: don't throw them into the floor you fool! If you do ofcourse there's a chance it explodes and you get hurt. Luckily Brawl will have warning stickers on exploding crates, so yay.
Though this won't stop exploding crates from appearing in front of you while you're charging your smash.

And you're right, smash pros don't call people who play 'silly smash' n00bs, they usually call them scrubs. Yeah seriously.


Also since you attend tournaments I gotta ask: Why is the Fountain of Dreams stage banned from tournaments (It is isn't it)? I understand a stage like Corneria could be used to camp at the right of the stage, can be unfair because of hazards, hazards breaking chain combo's and that shit. But why Fountain of Dreams, the only 'hazard' are 2 of the stage platforms moving up and down. If combo breaking is a reason then fuck tournaments.

[TV Eye]

dosv said:

Also to whoever said it, I love your "fat pasty nerd" stereotyping. Unfortunately I don't see 1 smasher in this video that fits your stereotype.

MLG Vegas - P.c Chirs (Falco) vs Ken (Fox) Kongo Jungle 64
www.youtube.com/watch?v=pIPssvmCAG0

Well, I don't agree that they are nerds, but that commentator had a reeeeally annoying voice.

[Smashchu]

dosv said:

Wavedashing is not a glitch first of all. If I remember correctly somewhere on the Debug Menu you see the term "Waveland Special" used. So yes, Wavedahsing was either put in or or left in the game intentionally so there's really no way you can classify it as a glitch.

The reason it is in the game is so you don't airdodge though the floor. Sure, it's not a glitch, but it doesn't mean it's an exploit that was taken out for good reason. You'd think if they liked it or didn't know about it they'd change airdodge.

Once again though, Snaking = something that furthers your goal in game. Wavedashing does not damage your opponent nor does it put them off the stage, so really it's nothing like Snaking.

Snaking doesn't hurt your foe either. Snaking also helps you win to show you have a bigger virtural penis and destroy your DS. How are they different again?

Now about the taking video games serious piece. There is absolutely nothing wrong with playing a video game for fun. But you just said that no one should ever take it serious because it's a game, thats where you're wrong. You can try to justify your lack of skill at the game by telling others they have no life all you want. That's nothing more than a losers excuse or what we like to call a "John". It's not hard to have a life and only play a game 2 or 3 times a month BTW.

The problem isn't more of less they play competitive, but they make it so serious. And then bring it to us. Call us n00bs for how we play, and claim wavedashing is so easy, anyone can do it (when it actually takes a good deal of time to learn how to use it effectively). In fact, how your talking is typical Tournay Fag fouder. We don't want to play the game that way, and don't care to learn how to move across the map at 1.5x the speed. Doesn't mean we have no skill, it means your a jerk.

As far as people hacking or cheating at a Super Smash Bros. Melee Tournament, that's something I have yet to see even after playing competitively for a little over a year. IF by hacking you mean using advanced techniques like wavedashing, l-canceling, jump canceled grab, ect. then that is in no way how you describe it. All these techniques were left int he game on purpose and already after playing the Brawl demo at E for All a few people have confirmed the return of most of the adv. techs we used in Melee. Why do the Devs keep putting this stuff in the game if it's a glitch? I'd really like to know.

1)Wavedashing is not in the game anymore. Devs took out something that was a glitch. A winnar is I
2)L-Cancelling is gone too

On another note, I can't name 1 professional smasher that would resort to any type of name calling after they beat someone who is not on par with them. I can name plenty of Halo players would would have no problem doing so. You can't really compare chess to the entire competitive video game community, especially since you'll find that most people who play the games on a competitive level don't play other games competitively unless it's a sequel or something similar. You can't group the Halo players with the SSBM players or any other gaming community.

Just becuase Halo players do it more doesn't mean Smash players are blameless. Look on Smashboards and you'll find plenty of "competative" players who are ready to jump on you for not wavedashing

Directional Airdodge was taken out which was the only known method of Wavedashing in Melee. Wavelanding is still in, and so is float cancel for Peach. Combine the two and you now have a Peach that can wavedash.

As a Peach player I can tell you it will not be effective. Peach is also one of those characters that didn't need wavedashing all that much.

My sole purpose for joining was not to yell at anyone, and I have not been doing so. I just happened to be reading over something when one of you said something that caught my eye. I'm not here to make casual players feel bad for doing anything, I'm just stating my opinion. Why isn't that ok? You guys see competitive Melee as players abusing glitches when in fact it's not that way. I'm merely trying to show you a competitive smasher's point of view. Of course you don't have to agree, but I still feel the need to say something.

My problem is that all the post you have made have been here. After a few days of being on this forum, one would think you'd make a post in one of the other topics that keep getting constantly bumped. You can have opinions. That's fine, but it may be weird when all you've posted is arguing with us.

[dosv]

Smash 64 is a very broken game. It's basically just camping for the first hit so that you can 0 to death your opponent no matter which character you are.

Fox shine brokenness in SSB 64.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=RoP1mPpR3uc

Poke Floats, Corneria and Fountain of Dreams are all tourney legal stages.
List of Legal stages according to MLG: smashboards.com/showthread.php?p=1898155#post1898155
The only reason stages are ever banned is because either some characters have game breaking tactics on those stage or if you can tech (when you catch yourself on a wall, ceiling, floor or ledge) you will live forever.

I've seen G-regulate destroy someone on bug blue with Kirby. G-regulate = 2nd or 3rd best Falcon in the country.

Crates don't only explode when you throw them. If they are moving and make contact with a character then they explode. All it takes for that to happen is for them to be on a slope, and yes they do spawn above slope quite often. So you can be on Corneria or Brinstar Depths and all the sudden you die because you either happened to be in front a slope and a barrel slid down and blew you up or you were on the slope and you just died from random explosion. If your statement was about items being tournament legal then just look here:

www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wefa0b8jAv4

Top pro west coast players in Low tier/Items tournament. There is something out there for every type of smasher, you just have to look around for it. I personally wouldn't enter something like that because Items = luck. I wouldn't want to be in a tournament with luck being a bigger factor than it is for me at normal tournaments. But I have no problem playing with items on just for fun with friends.

Snaking is different from wavedashing because in Mario Kart, you are trying to get from point A to point B before your opponent. Snaking will help you get there a lot faster. In Super Smash Bros. Melee you're trying to keep your opponent of the stage. Snaking by itself can help you get to the finish line faster if used correctly. Wavedashing (when used correctly) does not further your goal in the game. It does not do damage and it does not knock opponents off the stage. All it does it let you face one way while moving the other. But Moonwalking does the same thing so why don't people want that out of Brawl?

You can't tell someone they're taking it too serious. Smash is a very deep game (deepest fighting game ever made IMO). In order to be good on a competitive level you need to be dedicated and determined. I am in no way telling you that you should wavedash, and if you look back at all of my previous posts I never once said that. Also I never once called anywhere here a name. I can't determine your skill because my skill is based on the SSBM meta-game, while yours is not because you don't play competitively. So when did I call anyone here a n00b or a scrub and what reason do I have to do so?So you claim I'm a jerk after writing a paragraph about things I haven't even done?

1.) You just got finished saying Wavedashing was not a glitch and now you're saying it is.
You don't know why Devs tried to take it out but like I said they left in Wavelanding. If you know the difference between wavedashing and wavelanding you know that wavelanding takes you much further than wavedashing does. So any character that can double jump cancel can basically wavedash.

2.) L-cancel is now done by fastfalling your aerials, unlike Melee or 64 where you had to press a button at the right time. Gimpyfish confirmed this at E for All.

Fryguy said name one professional chess player who would call someone a n00b after winning. The SSBM equivalent to a pro chess player would be a pro Melee player right? I stand by what I said before, I don't see SSBM pros talking down on anyone on the boards or in real life after they win a game.

How about you go look on smashboards yourself and tell me what you found. What I usually see in the General Brawl Discussion section is people who just joined making threads about why wavedashing should not be in brawl or why pros disgust them. Then I see more people who just joined argue back with them about how they suck because they can't wavedash or why wavedashing should be in Brawl. Never once do I see someone just say they cannot wavedash and then someone talk down on them because they can't use it.

As far as Wavedashing with Peach goes, you don't NEED it for any character at all. But every top Peach player that I know of makes very good use of her wavedash (Mike G., Cort, P.c Chris, Azen, Kirbstir, Doll ect. I could go on forever). None of the characters needed wavedashing and nobody is dependent on it. If they take it out completely I will be a little disappointed because at first I'll feel like the game wont have as much depth as Melee. Maybe my feelings will change and maybe they wont , but regardless I will still play Brawl for the same reason I play Melee: to have fun.

Out of every topic on this forum this is the only one that made me want to finally make an account. I just wanted to voice my opinion on this situation. Tell me, were exactly did I go wrong ?