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Post by 8bitretroshit on Mar 20, 2009 20:18:15 GMT -5
The original gen was all about simplicity. Generic monochromatic designs that are only loosely based on real-world creatures. Since, the games have been making Pokemon way more exotic, colorful, POWERFUL (the DPP beasts rape anything that isn't DPP in the metagame and it saddens me), and very specifically "this is what this Pokemon is based on." Compare Pineco to Burmy. Both bagworms, but there's a stark contrast in the paths their design took. Even the simplicity of the starters and the "route 1 bird/rodent" have changed markedly throughout the games. It's weird to think about what Gen 5 will look like. That’s pretty much why I think the second gen’s the best: most of 'em look like a bunch of average animals. Most of the R/S D/P newcomers after that look more like a bunch of space aliens to me. And I want Rattata back in my starter zone  |
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Post by Koopaul on Mar 20, 2009 21:18:22 GMT -5
Yeah look at Claydol. You can't tell if its facing backwards or forwards... Or if it even has a forward! That's the whole thing, how can you feel an emotional bond with something that doesn't look alive? Even Magnemite seemed more alive than Claydol and others.
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Post by TV Eye on Mar 20, 2009 21:45:21 GMT -5
Compare Pineco to Burmy. Both bagworms, but there's a stark contrast in the paths their design took. Even the simplicity of the starters and the "route 1 bird/rodent" have changed markedly throughout the games. It's weird to think about what Gen 5 will look like. Actually, Pineco is a...well...a pinecone. In my opinion, the original Pokemon are only liked because they were the originals. The ones you'd see everywhere, hell, when I was a kid I could name them all in order by heart. Nowadays, Pokemon just isn't as popular so the exposure isn't as incredible as it once was. I mean come one. Diglet and Dugtrio (also Magnemite and Magneton) were the worst designed Pokemon ever. Oh wow. When he (it?) evolves it combines with two other versions. How is that creative? Voltorb? Electrode? Yawn. But then you look at how much detail has been put into the newer Pokemon...       Sure, I love the old Pokemon, but there's absolutely nothing wrong with the new ones. |
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Post by Boo Destroyer on Mar 20, 2009 21:47:40 GMT -5
Generation 2 had a few WTF evolutions.
Mareep to Flaaffy to...AMPHAROS. Sheep to dino?
Remoraid to Octillery. Yeah.
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Post by Shrikeswind on Mar 20, 2009 22:41:19 GMT -5
I feel I have to say it: I can't stand how the starter's final evolutions are doing anymore. Since Generation 3 they haven't been what I could consider a group, and on top of that, Generation 2 wasn't too memorable. The Beasts of Kanto were friggin' awesome, the Monsters of Johto were fad-ish, the Creatures of Hoenn were pretty cool but they didn't fit together that well, and the Trio of Sinnoh? Come on! Rowan didn't even TRY to find Pokemon that fit together! Just slapped a bunch of random animals together! It's miserable is what it is.
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Post by The Qu on Mar 20, 2009 22:49:38 GMT -5
Ampharos was supposed to be a wooless sheep, from what I've heard. That would make sense. Also, Pineco is a pine cone plus a hand grenade; it's evolution is the bag worm.
I will say this on teh design front: When Satoshi Itaji conceived Pokemon, he thought of incorporating gender differences and regional differences. So, with Shellos and Burmy, we are just coming into what he thought of with his original idea.
As for the dominance of fourth generation Pokemon... They'll get nerfed in teh next gen. Hell, they added such a great deal of past gen Pokemon in Platinum to the main quest, I'm sure they'll have a few competitors.
Teev is right: The original designs were simpler. Probably out of hardware limitations, at that. Nowadays, they can make the sprite look just like Ken Sugimori's official art. So, with that in mind, perhaps they want to make more elaborate designs.
With that in mind, I think my favorite designs are from Gen 2. I'm still partial to Cyniquil and the Marreep family.
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Post by Boo Destroyer on Mar 20, 2009 23:09:38 GMT -5
I can still remember the 1st generation by heart, even in order. And I love a great deal of them.
My favorites of the 4th generation are the starters...Lucario...Garchomp...........Dialga...........Palkia...............
............
and, and..........
Sorry, but that's how hard they're beating that horse to death with it now.
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Post by Johans Nidorino on Mar 20, 2009 23:35:48 GMT -5
The ones you'd see everywhere, hell, when I was a kid I could name them all in order by heart. I can still remember the 1st generation by heart, even in order. Pokéfreaks! I don't think I ever learned that order. But hey, that's something to brag about, I guess  Evolutions that consist of multiplying heads or bodies are good examples of older species that we'd have to worry about if they appeared in a current generation. I don't doubt they would be criticized. In that GamesRadar interview, Masuda claimed there are no plans for a DSi game yet but that they consider it a fun idea. Any ideas of how could the DSi's camera be used in Pokémon? Perhaps specific moves that use photographs (like how Chatter uses the microphone)? |
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Post by Koopaul on Mar 21, 2009 18:33:48 GMT -5
I'm gonna have to dissagree Teev. It was their simplicity that made them so loveable.
I probably wouldn't have fallen in love with the series if they used the Pokemon of today back then.
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Post by Johans Nidorino on Mar 21, 2009 19:42:59 GMT -5
Even in the first generation, there was stuff that bothered me if you are looking specifically at the design of the creatures. Especially that transition from Poliwhirl to Poliwrath. I've came to love Poliwrath because of its use in battle, but definitely not because of the creativity of its evolution from Poliwhirl.
I don't think Infernape and Empoleon have beaten Charizard and Blastoise. But really, Dugtrio and Magneton make me feel nostalgic for the genesis of the franchise more than they make me think there have been much worse Pokémon.
Anyway, I don't fully understand the definition of some of you about simplicity. Are you talking about the details in their bodies and skins, or simplicity as in what are they based on? Because Azumarill isn't a plain rabbit unlike Buneary for example, and I kind of see Azumarill more interesting.
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Post by Arcadenik on Mar 21, 2009 21:08:47 GMT -5
There are some Pokemon designs I liked, some I didn't like, some I found interesting, some I didn't find interesting, some I find cute, some I find not so cute. It happens.  |
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Post by Koopaul on Mar 21, 2009 23:40:29 GMT -5
@johans:
What I mean by simplicity is not over-detailed. Look at Ghastly, its simply a black ball with eyes and a mouth covered in smoke. So I kinda mean their body and skin. Not concept.
You see if a Pokemon concept like Diglet (whack-a-mole) was designed today, he'd probably have stripes, swirly eyes, a helmet like thing on his head... etc. Instead of the brown lump with eyes and a nose.
Imagine having this swirly eyed helmet wearing thing. Too much if you ask me. It is just lovely as a brown lump, thank you.
I'm fine with any silly concept as long as the Pokemon looks likeable. I mean the mime Pokemon idea sounds dumb but when you look at what they made, you can't help but fall in love with the weirdo.
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Post by Manspeed on Mar 22, 2009 8:50:19 GMT -5
Meh....I find most of the newer Pokemon to be forgettable mainly because they're rehashes of previous Pokemon just with more knick knacks and doodads thrown on. It bothers me even more when they give us a new evolution of an older Pokemon but it ends following this same design scheme.
Fortunately there are some truly original designs, such as Nosepass, but those are getting fewer and farther between.
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Post by Boo Destroyer on Mar 22, 2009 14:40:55 GMT -5
As far as Lucario is concerned, it seems to be one of the fourth generation's very few saving graces. It actually seems to act and feel like an earlier-gen Pokemon.
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Post by Koopaul on Mar 22, 2009 15:05:02 GMT -5
Yep, I agree that these new generations have a few gems like Lucario and Buneary.
But I think the 3rd generation was the worst.
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