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Post by Dances in Undergarments on Sept 18, 2012 7:49:54 GMT -5
Surely at this point you're taking the piss, right? At first I thought you were making the dumbest fucking point I've ever read on the internet, but surely you can't really be serious about it any more. Surely this is all a joke now. Surely.
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Post by Boo Destroyer on Sept 18, 2012 12:33:32 GMT -5
The flagpoles test your ability to jump far from a higher place (depending on how it's set up) to see if you can reach that 1-Up (at least for this time if you lack the Flying Squirrel power). Like The Qu has said, it's become a staple at this point, like with blocks and all the other stuff like the Fire Flower, and continues to hold up well. Maybe they felt that the other goal ideas that they tried just didn't work out as well? In that case my favorite was SMB3 with the card panels. I loved getting three in a row and hearing the "duh duh da duh dadada DAAAA!" ...Then don't buy NSMBU and just keep playing SMB3. |
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Post by kirbychu on Sept 18, 2012 12:50:30 GMT -5
See, I really hated that stupid card thing. It was the worst. Hit a block to finish the stage? Awesome! It's not like I've been doing that the whole fucking stage already! SMW's weird rugby post thing was a little better, but it's still so boring that I mostly just walk under it.
Flagpoles, though? Flagpoles are great! They let you end the stage with one last test of skill, they're diverse in their setups, and they give me a much better sense of satisfaction. Maybe that last part is just me, but "I bounced across the enemies and reached the very top of the pole!" seems like a better feeling than "I did a tiny jump and saw a picture of a star!"
Nintendo could probably market a Mario phone game using flagpole jumps alone. This is the kind of stuff people play for hours on the train already.
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Post by Dances in Undergarments on Sept 18, 2012 18:28:15 GMT -5
OK, I'll indulge in this fucking dumb argument for a second. NSMB was an SMB throwback, designed to provoke a bit of nostalgia. Therefore, having a flagpole at the end was necessary. So it had to be in that one. So from there, lets look at what else they could have brought back.... The 'rugby goal' is essentially the flagpole anyway - you try and get to the highest part you can for the most points. If the end of the level has a great affect on gameplay (pro tip: it fucking doesn't), then its the same fucking gameplay as the flagpole. The SMB3 goal, meanwhile, is as kirbychu said, jumping into a fucking block, which is exactly what you've done all level. The only difference in both is that they have timing components, which doesn't really work with speed runs, which Nintendo has put a bit of a focus on with the recent games. They'd also both have to be modified for multiplayer support - does only player one get a card or are there 4 ending blocks? Do the cards 'pool' together or are they individual? Meanwhile, does only one player get to 'break the tape' of the rugby goal? If all 4 can get it, does that ruin the bit of a 'race to the finish' fun you now get with multiplayer NSMB? The flagpole always gives the same score if you can reach the top - it therefore can test platforming skill to get there, doesn't require you to stop your run, and remains there so that 4 people can get the same score on it if they are all just as skilled. In other fucking words - it was chosen for a fucking reason. There's a reason you're not a game developer Koopaul. Just because something would add to the rich, fulfilling Mario lore (not sure how I got through that one with a straight face), doesn't make it any better for the game as a fucking game. Miyamoto, and other great developers, know this. You don't. Surely this is over. Surely we have hit the flagpole / rugby goal / card block / kirby trampoline / ring of flowers / barrel / cannon you get to waggle in for some fucking reason of this thread now.  |
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Post by Arcadenik on Sept 18, 2012 20:03:25 GMT -5
Okay, I gotta be honest. This "collect 1 million coins" thing NSMB2 has going... it didn't excite me when I first heard about it... but I am really hooked on NSMB2. I got over 200,000 coins already and I've earned 5 stars on my file. I even managed to pick up thousands of coins in certain individual levels with the help of the Gold Fire Flower. I'm really digging the Coin Rush mode.
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Post by Koopaul on Sept 18, 2012 23:44:07 GMT -5
Jesus guys, I didn't say SMB3 ending would be better for this, I was just saying it was my favorite.
Of course it wouldn't work for NSMB's multiplayer. I didn't say it would. That was just my person favorite not an argument for what they should be using.
I really don't see inventing a new way to end a level is so horrible. They had been doing it for years until now.
But you guys think that because it works that they shouldn't do anything new. Well you guys know everything so I guess it must be true.
I guess you guys must hate the idea that they have this Flying Squirrel Mario when Raccoon Mario was perfect.
Why the hell would they invent a new powerup? That's ridiculous! They should just use the Raccoon Mario forever! No better yet! They should just re-release the original Super Mario Bros. forever since everything that game did was perfect. And if it ain't broke don't fix it!
EDIT: Phew. Sorry about that one guys. But Dances in Underwear can be... well you know.
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Post by kirbychu on Sept 19, 2012 1:38:38 GMT -5
I really don't see inventing a new way to end a level is so horrible. They had been doing it for years until now. This is my point... they had been trying for years to find something that works as well as the flagpole, and they failed every time. Now they've finally cottoned on to the fact that they actually had it right in the first place. If you can think of something that'd be as fun and challenging as the flagpole, I'm all ears. |
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Post by Koopaul on Sept 19, 2012 2:06:03 GMT -5
I'm just saying all those different ways to end a level helped each game feel more distinct. I'm sure Nintendo could come up with something if they tried.
Actually that sounds like a fun idea! We should all try coming up with something! Hm... let me try again.
Ah! How about each level ends with the characters jumping down a giant vine or rope? It would be like a game of Chicken, the closer to the ground you fall the bigger the bonus, press A to grap the vine. Fall to the bottom and you don't get anything. Eh I don't know it could be fun.
Oh and thank you Kirbychu for posting your argument in a calm and smart way.
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Post by 8bitretroshit on Sept 19, 2012 5:08:40 GMT -5
Each level ends with a discofloor and you have to let Mario do a little jig. If you get a D rating or below you have to replay the level
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Post by Arcadenik on Sept 19, 2012 6:22:12 GMT -5
Koopaul, that "jumping onto a rope/vine" idea you got? It sounds like the flagpole, only upside-down. And dancing? Really? I'd rather finish a level by fighting Birdo and entering the Hawkmouth if we have to get rid of the flagpole.
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Post by Dances in Undergarments on Sept 19, 2012 7:43:10 GMT -5
Jesus guys, I didn't say SMB3 ending would be better for this, I was just saying it was my favorite. Of course it wouldn't work for NSMB's multiplayer. I didn't say it would. That was just my person favorite not an argument for what they should be using. I really don't see inventing a new way to end a level is so horrible. They had been doing it for years until now. But you guys think that because it works that they shouldn't do anything new. Well you guys know everything so I guess it must be true. I guess you guys must hate the idea that they have this Flying Squirrel Mario when Raccoon Mario was perfect. Why the hell would they invent a new powerup? That's ridiculous! They should just use the Raccoon Mario forever! No better yet! They should just re-release the original Super Mario Bros. forever since everything that game did was perfect. And if it ain't broke don't fix it! EDIT: Phew. Sorry about that one guys. But Dances in Underwear can be... well you know. I'm glad you were able to cotton on to my argument that the video gaming world was perfected in 1987, and therefore nothing new should be created ever. I thought I'd managed to hide it with my meaningful post that actually aimed to explain, through logical, thought-out reasoning, why the element you were incessantly complaining about might just be there for a reason, so I'm glad you were able to put the blinkers on and get straight through that one. Hooray for subtext! |
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Post by nocturnal YL on Sept 19, 2012 7:43:32 GMT -5
Koopaul, that "jumping onto a rope/vine" idea you got? It sounds like the flagpole, only upside-down. ...No. It would be like a game of Chicken. And dancing? Really? I'd rather finish a level by fighting Birdo and entering the Hawkmouth if we have to get rid of the flagpole. I don't think 8-bit's comment is to be taken seriously... You can't seriously ask players to play a second game to win first. |
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Post by Manspeed on Sept 19, 2012 21:02:57 GMT -5
I kinda liked the bell from Mario Land 2. If it were multiplayer, they could have it so the player who hits the bell gets a prize of some sort.
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Post by Koopaul on Sept 20, 2012 0:07:16 GMT -5
Yeah that was kind of neat. That would be hard to work for multiplayer though.
How about instead of sliding down the flagpole it pole-vaults the players into the air. Whoever gets flung the farthest get's the best bonus?
It would be an interesting twist on the Flagpole.
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Post by Fryguy64 on Sept 20, 2012 2:13:16 GMT -5
The higher up you get the more points/rewards you get. It's the same in almost every Mario game, whether it's a Flagpole, Goal, Bell, Secret Door, etc. Only SMB3 went with the card game, which actually works if you go nuts (like we did) with the Mario Bros. style multiplayer, stealing cards off each other.
While I think it's absolutely fine for the NSMB series, the Flagpole was bullshit in SM3DL... That could have done with a new method of completion.
But let's not forget glorious Yoshi's Island! The goal's value was improved by the efforts you made during the stage. Would you get a bonus? Improve your chances (and score) by getting the flowers! So why not something that harkens back to DA BESS GEM EVARS!?
Hell, it could be a flagpole for all I care, but everything should be Yoshi's Island. I mean... everything should be as well thought out as Yoshi's Island.
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