E3 2013 discussions

[nocturnal YL]

I was about to write this yesterday, but I completely forgot about it after switching to other browser tabs.

Anyway, we've about 14 days until Nintendo Direct, and I think this one deserves a separate thread from the Nintendo Direct thread.

To start, here's a list of announced games:

Wii U:
3D Suepr Mario
Mario Kart
Super Smash Bros.
Zelda: Wind Waker
New Zelda
Wii Fit U
Shin Megami Tensei x Fire Emblem
New Super Luigi U
Pikmin 3
Monolith's "X" game
Mario & Sonic 2014 (Nintendo-published in Japan)
Yarn Yoshi
Bayonetta 2
Wii Party U?

3DS:
Mario & Luigi: Dream Team
Mario Golf: Wold Tour
Zelda: A Link to the Past 2
Super Smash Bros.
Yoshi's Island 3
Flipnote Studio 3D
Pokémon X & Y (Pokémon don't usually show up in E3 presentations, but with the change of Nintendo's format of E3, who knows?)

Others:
Retro's new game?
Other than Nintendo, companies like SEGA and Ubisoft seem to have their own sizeable Wii U catalogs too
Whatever else that I missed


And now, my predictions.

It's unlikely that everything in this list will be shown. If anything, I highly doubt if the new Zelda will be shown, since it's pretty early in development and Wind Waker will come first.

I think the ones that have screenshots and footages already shown (like Yoshi's Island) will be more likely to get playable demos. The ones that are nearly finished and already have playable demos shown elsewhere, like M&L4, will definitely be there in E3. On the other hand, don't expect Smash Bros. (halfway done) or Wind Waker (Outset Island was the only place modelled in last month's presentation, apparently) to be playable.

We may get release dates in one or more regions for 3D Mario and Mario Kart. And maybe Wii Fit U too, even though this game hasn't received any mention for months.

Given Sakurai's eagerness to show stuff (despite the huge amount of sometimes bothersome Twitter messages he gets from fans), the next Smash Bros. Dojo may open after E3. I hope he doesn't give away everything before release like he did with all 3 previous games, but it seems unlikely. If Dojo 4 doesn't open this E3, it will happen before next year.

On the Japanese games' side, I predict that SMTxFE, Xeno-whatever and Bayonetta 2 will all have at least screenshots shown. Probably video trailer as well for Bayonetta 2.

And of course, games already with videos released (Yarn Yoshi, Mario Golf, etc) will get further trailer treatment.

And finally, I predict that E3 will mark the beginning of Flipnote 3D and the new Flipnote service. If Hatena's service ends in May, it's only reasonable to guess that the new one will start in June, and E3 is a perfect timing for this.

Thoughts?

[8bitretroshit]

I'm hyped as shit for this E3. For once I don't have to have such a glass half empty attitude because we already know they'll reveal some awesome new shit this E3. Mario, Mariokart and Smash Bros footage alone seals the deal for me. Possible extra Yoshi, Pikmin and XY information is just icing on the cake. Retro's reveal is probably Metroid related (snore), but who knows they'll surprise me.

Also as cool as the live E3 presentations were, the directs will no doubt be less cringeworthy to watch.

[Leon]

I am very interested in seeing more of X, that game will be amazing.

I also want to see some smaller externally developed 3DS games. It's time for something like Fossil Fighters or Jet Impulse to make a debut.

[Fryguy64]

Nintendo needs this E3 to sell the Wii U. I was initially against the idea of them not doing a press conference as they need all the exposure they can get. The 3DS recovered and is doing very well, but the Wii U desperately needs a reversal of fortunes. I understand that there was little point them competing in the hardware race that is now underway between Microsoft and Sony, but Nintendo needs to establish a few things:

• Nintendo has a year's headstart over the competition, but it doesn't feel like it. It's been 7 months and we're still essentially playing the (meagre) first party launch catalogue and a sprinkling of third-party ports. Nintendo needs to prove that by this Christmas there will be a significant increase in first- and third-party software.
• Sony and Microsoft are once again relying on moar grafix to push their systems, but we have reached a stage where the generational leaps in graphics are becoming less noticeable, and the importance of artistry is paramount. Nintendo needs to prove this by showing off games that look as impressive as anything Sony or Microsoft has prepared.
• Nintendo is going to have to absorb the criticism around overusing their key franchises. Mario sells. Kart sells. Zelda sells. Smash Bros. sells. They need to show games that everyone will want to play and reduce the number of gimmicks. They need to be playable at E3, and they need to be released soon.
• Nintendo needs to have a more robust online offering too. The Wii had a huge Virtual Console library at launch, which tided us over with weekly releases until the games started coming out (which was a lot quicker than Wii U releases have been coming out). They need to announce some download-exclusive software that makes use of the system even if it's just to tide us over.
• Ah hell, even though I think the Wii U launch has been the worst-handled in Nintendo's history, you and I both know that the second they show SSB4 then I will forgive them everything. And I hope there ARE daily Dojo updates! I enjoy it more than the damn game! ;D

[Nester the Lark]

^ So what you're saying, essentially, is... the Wii U needs games.

I don't know how much I'll pay attention to E3 this year. Heck, I never even watch the Nintendo Directs. It's just easier to read about the interesting parts after the fact.

Plus, I almost feel that gaming has diverged from what used to engage me. I think that a lot of what they show will only make me wonder why I'm supposed to get excited about it.

Or maybe it's that I'm 34-years-old, and most games are made for people 10 years younger than me. Games aimed at my age bracket probably assume that I'm only interested in Angry Birds or Wii Fit, which I'm not. So, I've effectively fallen through the cracks.

[Shadrio]

Some wishful thinking? Sega agrees to having Bayonetta remade for the Wii U, in hopes to "excite Wii U owners on the upcoming sequel". Seeing the whole Nintendo/Sega happiness flowing from the last Nintendo Direct, I don't think it's outside the realm of possibility (could be that 3rd title they mentioned in said Nintendo Direct, or did they specifically say that the 3 titles were sonic titles? I can't recall). I know my brother would be pleased with such an announcement.

Outside of that, I guess I'd like to be surprised by a new F-Zero for the Wii U or 2D Metroid for the 3DS (heck, I'd settle for a "Zero Mission" of Metroid II or Super Metroid)

[nocturnal YL]

I just hope that Nintendo won't try less harder because PS4 and Xbox One are laughable (especially the latter). I agree with most stuff Fry said. They need to show the Wii U's power - not for the gamers, but for the developers. You can't win a Sony fanboy over, but you can get the bunch of people who don't care about gaming systems and are only getting them because of compatibility issues. You want to play Yakuza? You can either get a PS3, or get a Wii U that plays it AND a bunch of other stuff. (On the topic of Yakuza, yeah, localization please. Even though I don't care about the game.)

May 28, 2013 19:08:05 GMT -5 Nester the Lark said:

Or maybe it's that I'm 34-years-old, and most games are made for people 10 years younger than I. Games aimed at my age bracket probably assume that I'm only interested in Angry Birds or Wii Fit, which I'm not. So, I've effectively fallen through the cracks.

And I am 10 years younger than you. Yay!

Hey developers! Ya hear that? There's a cetegory of people called "gamers that aren't below 30"! Unclaimed market! Go for it!
...No, not Virtual Console. That's lazy, and not to mention it doesn't have anything new.


I listed my expectation in the first post, but not anything I want to see (new announcements). To be honest, I don't really have any. Like 8bit said, Mario, Mario Kart and Smash Bros alone are already making this E3 awesome. If I have to say, it'd be that I want to see lots of game footage.

I've been reading everywhere that Smash Bros will be presented in screenshot form, but it is very apparent that everyone is expecting video. if they manage to mess this up by really not showing Smash Bros video, then people who don't fact-check (= most people) will start crying liar. So consider this my biggest wish for this E3: No matter how unfinished the game is, show some video. Actually, show lots of it - at least 2 minutes. The core system is already done, so this should be no problem... I hope.

[Wildcat]

I'm curious about E3, and some of the excitement of year's past remains within me, but I am very weary of the direction Microsoft is wanting to take gaming (I suspect Sony will be doing similar, but hopefully less severe, behavior with the PS4). I want to play a game on a gaming console, not have a multimedia center. That's what my laptop is for. That being said, I hope the new Smash Bros. will woo me like they have in the past. There's nothing quite like a trailer for that series.

[Nester the Lark]

Last week, I made some sarcastic comment on Twitter like, "What happened to those boxes you used to plug into your TV and played games on?" I suppose that could've been read as "consoles are dead," but what I really meant was, "I miss the simplicity of a dedicated game console."

I'm sure I've made myself sound like Cranky Kong with a comment like that, but we never used to have to worry about "extra" console features, like online, DLC, user accounts, internal memory, DVD/Blu-ray, and whatever else they put in there. They were like toasters. You put a game in, turned it on, played it, and that was it.

And I understand why they're doing it. Everything is heavily integrated these days. Most people barely even use their phones as phones. Instead, they're using their phones primarily as gaming devices, and gaming devices are being used primarily as Blu-ray players. Up is down, and forward is north by northwest.

Is it a sign that gaming is stagnant that they have to add in all this extra junk that has nothing to do with gaming, or is it the case that game consoles really are dying, and are becoming merely a feature of multi-use entertainment devices?

I guess this is just a new era, and I shouldn't be so shortsighted as to say that things shouldn't be changing.  But I miss my toaster.

[8bitretroshit]

Your toaster ain't going anywhere though. Just plug in and play while you shout to those hip hoppin' Day 1 DLC kids to get off your darn lawn!

I don't mind most of these extra features for consoles aslong as it doesn't interfere with me playing some actual games (looking at you PS3 and your stupid trophies). And Nintendo really SHOULD move to an account system. The way they handle digital purchases now is hardly better than the bullshit EA pulled before they had Origin.

Unlike Sony and Microsoft, Nintendo itself is a company that primarily develops videogame soft- and hardware so I don't expect the next console to be focused on watching Netflix and ordering pizza's.

May 29, 2013 8:50:02 GMT -5 nocturnal YL said:

I've been reading everywhere that Smash Bros will be presented in screenshot form, but it is very apparent that everyone is expecting video. if they manage to mess this up by really not showing Smash Bros video, then people who don't fact-check (= most people) will start crying liar. So consider this my biggest wish for this E3: No matter how unfinished the game is, show some video. Actually, show lots of it - at least 2 minutes. The core system is already done, so this should be no problem... I hope.

Even if they can't get a playable version done on time I'm sure they'll atleast have a fancy reveal trailer... right?? Aw heck, even if they'd only release 3 screenshots of Mario's idle animation I'd be all over that.

[Dances in Undergarments]

I don't understand criticising game consoles for doing more than just games. Its not an 'instead of' proposition, its an 'in addition to' one - you can still plug your console in, pop in a game, and play it (well, in theory, there's all that mandatory installation stuff now, but that isn't changed whether a console does one thing or a hundred things). If you're arguing that time, resources and people working on these non-gaming features takes away from the opportunity to work on games, then maybe you have a point, but I really don't think that is true, either, since I really doubt the same person who is programming in the ability to watch Netflix on a console is the same dude that would've created the next Mario. In all honesty, if I'm buying a box that costs me $500 or whatever, I'd want it to do a damn sight more than just 'play Zelda'. You're right in your own criticism that you sound like an "old man yells at cloud", because you really do. Nothing has been lost with the addition of extra features, and everything has been gained.

.......

....

....that being said, the move to increase profit margins through the use of cut content turning into DLC, the reduction and possible demise of the used game market, and the death of the simple act of buying a game and lending it to your friend for them to play it is terrible. The Xbone is absolutely doubling down on this, and it worries me. I suspect the PS4 has put some similar measures in place, too, and in all honesty, if Nintendo wasn't firmly stuck a generation behind the rest of the world, they'd probably be all over it. The NSMB U / New Super Luigi U's method of selling a full game with no cut content, then developing a whole new game as DLC, is fantastic, but how long will that kind of mindset stay around? I strongly suspect the next Smash Bros will have DLC, and I think that is a good idea, but I also suspect it may just be characters that could've made it for launch simply being held back to sell piece by piece later down the track. I hope that is not what we see, but everyone else is moving that way, and Nintendo will too. Preorder at EB Games to unlock an exclusive Ridley playable character, that type of shit will happen.


Back to the topic at hand, eh, E3 should be good. I'm in for new Mario, Kart, and Smash. Anything else cool will be a bonus. I'm hoping PS4 and Xbone have some real mindblowing games, too.

[nocturnal YL]

I'm not sure if the bonus really is costing nothing. Wii U's games have been known for being late to the scene because efforts are put into the Wii U console itself.

I'm not too worried about Nintendo's own DLC for now - and I'll say I actually want to see those in Smash Bros, as long as the main game won't offer less as a result. They seem to have a stance on it: DLCs are meant to be extra contents, and games should be playable without them.

Having seen many other great companies falling into evilness, though, I can't say I'm not worried at all. But this is not likely to happen to Nintendo in this generation.

[Dances in Undergarments]

May 31, 2013 3:18:12 GMT -5 nocturnal YL said:

I'm not sure if the bonus really is costing nothing. Wii U's games have been known for being late to the scene because efforts are put into the Wii U console itself.

Show me where, because I really doubt, say, Pikmin's late release has anything to do with the development of different Miiverse communities or whatever.


And I'm glad you have lots of faith in Nintendo, but, come on. They're just as bad as the others, and the only reason they might not join the rest of the 'festivities' this generation is because they're so far behind the eight ball.

[Nester the Lark]

Heh, I deserve that. It was a cranky, old man rant.

It's not necessarily a bad thing that consoles do more than just games. I've never complained that my Wii could use Netflix (which I've used), or that my Dreamcast could play CDs, and I've spent enough money on the Wii Shop to prove that I'm willing to put up with a certain degree of games being tied to a user account (or console, in this case). I'm just saying I miss streamlined simplicity.

Before I owned a Dreamcast, I never had to go through a system menu to get to my games. I put a cartridge in my SNES, flipped a switch, and I was good to go. Not that system menus are that big of a deal--it only takes a few extra seconds--but looks where it's gone. Now we have mandatory system updates and user accounts, and that kind of thing creates more chances for things to go wrong. PS3 owners complain about the extra hours it takes for an update to install before they can even start a new game. Then there was the PSN hacking incident a couple of years ago. Microsoft is taking it to an extreme with their DRM policies on the Xbox One, with mandatory installations and tying retail games to user accounts, that are clearly moving things even further away from the "pop a game in and play it" usability that I'm starting to miss.

And I think it's possible for a device that most people will probably buy to use as a games console to do too much. To me, it's a bunch of extra clutter that's starting to get in the way. It's getting to be too complicated for my cranky old brain.

So, I'll say it again: I miss my toaster.

[Boo Destroyer]

May 31, 2013 3:33:22 GMT -5 Dances in Undergarments said:

May 31, 2013 3:18:12 GMT -5 nocturnal YL said:

I'm not sure if the bonus really is costing nothing. Wii U's games have been known for being late to the scene because efforts are put into the Wii U console itself.

Show me where, because I really doubt, say, Pikmin's late release has anything to do with the development of different Miiverse communities or whatever.

This is actually being done for Wii Fit U to hold tournaments and the like.